6.1 How to run a pop up kitchen with Gayathiri Manoharan

Transcript

Welcome back hung up season 6 My name is Matt, I’m Aiden. We have been on hiatus for a little bit. We had to do some soul searching, some atoning for our sins, some soul seeking, and some deep investigations into

what makes art good, what makes art worth talking about on a podcast. Yes, so true. I’m so excited that the first episode of the new season is a chef. Yes. Who did we speak to? Matt? We chatted to our new friend Gaia, who’s also known as Table

at Gaia’s. She’s doing this really cool pop up with Angus Marrickville, a cafe 69 Meeks Rd. which the pop up ends tomorrow if you’re listening to this on Saturday when it comes out. So please go down and get a sambal sandwich. Yeah, really interesting conversation. We covered a lot of ground,

including some deep, dark secrets of the sort of scary industrial food trade, which was something that I I leaked. I leaked. So if if I die after this, I didn’t commit suicide, whatever they say, it wasn’t me.

I won’t let them get me. I have no handling of any plutonium or poisonous things in my life. I love my life. No, it wasn’t that. It wasn’t that bad and able. To fall back on the cigarettes, but he was a pack a day smoker. Like. He was young, but it’s possible. He was a kid. He was a kid too soon. Yeah.

And it’s a it’s a really hot day. We had the air conditioning running. Sorry. Sorry. OK, we’re sweaty guys. We needed to be chill. And for the guests it’s nice as well. We’re going to. Make the guests comfortable. We have water, we have air conditioning, we have ambient playing noises. A sticky leather couch. The guests are listening to their favorite music.

The car is the air conditioning is on. Please do not break the window. It.

Might be fun to start off with, like doing a taste test like and like. Oh yeah, that’s a great idea. You know, enjoying this. Thing together so hungry as well. This is breakfast.

No, no, no, no, no. It’s OK. Yeah, All right, let’s let’s let’s try it. Yeah, Let’s roll. Yeah. So what have we got here? So. We’ve got a chocolate sponge cake with the miso chocolate icing. I hope you both like it, and if you don’t, I don’t want to hear it. No, it looks beautiful. Thank you so much for bringing

it. This is the first ever. Is it the first guest that’s brought us? Yeah, we had tomato soup with Alex Sherry, but you. Remember, we made that. Yeah, yeah. OK, I was like, hello, who’s making tomato soup and bringing it? This is so exciting. And it was really exciting as I was at ALDI and they had the bunt mould, which you know which one I’m talking about, right?

You know those like Christmas cakes? Oh yes, the upside down. It’s got a whole. It’s essentially like a doughnut. Yeah. Anyway, so I saw it was so cute. It was like baby pink is on. I was like, I have to buy it. And I was like, wait, I have to make a chocolate cake now? OK, I’m going to try the first bite of the live text. Oh my God, drum roll. Please no.

It’s so good, Oh my God. Hates it. No. Oh my God, it’s delicious. Thank you. I love chocolate cake. I’m like a classic gold day and day. Even though for my food adventures I do, you know, get really excited and try new flavours, Sure. But because I was bringing this for you guys, I was like, I need to add a little twist otherwise. So be like, go, what are you doing? What are you doing with the

chocolate cake? That’s beautiful. It’s beautiful. It’s. Really good. Wow, such a good break. When did you make this? Yesterday. Wow. Perks of freelancing. Yeah. Unemployment. Sometimes, yeah. Tell me about it that. We’re all able to do this on a Thursday morning. Yeah. Wednesday morning, yeah. What? So you do like baking as well or? I’m baking doesn’t really come

easily to me because I’m big on cooking with my feelings and not with recipe. But there’s few things like cake, you know, standard, I can do that, and few other things, simple baking I can do. But yeah, this is a struggle of mine and a goal of mine for this year is to start writing recipes. Don’t hold me to it, but I’m going to try. It’s cool.

Yeah. Yeah. Recipe writing is so cool. I’ve got, I was just talking about this last night. I’ve got this, like, recipe book that my grandmother did. I don’t know if I’ll be able to reach it with this mic cable, but she, like, she was living in Cyprus in the, like, 1950s. I’ll show it to you later. But it’s like the most amazing thing, like, you know, lots of like local recipes that I don’t know, may not have been written

down otherwise. But yeah, very cool stuff. OK, so welcome to Hung up. We’ve we’ve started rolling. I don’t know if you guys knew that guy. Do you want to introduce yourself for our guest? So my name is Gayathiri Manoharan. That’s my full government name. I’m a event producer by day and I also have a business called Table and Guys.

Cool. And tell us about Table of Gaia’s. How did that start? Yeah. So to be honest, I’ve loved food my whole life. My mum’s an amazing cook, so I had such a big influence of having delicious food all the time around me. And something that a lot of people may or may not know is that I managed a restaurant for six years. So that was a big part of my

life that I often forget. And a friend would always remind me, hey, like, remember, you did that for like a whole part of your life. And I was like, yeah. And that was such a big insight to my love for food. And I had so much creative freedom from, like, menu designing to, like, working with head chefs to coming up, like, really cool different ways of putting food items on the menu.

And there was a Japanese restaurant as well. So it had a big influence of different Japanese ingredients that I didn’t really know growing up. And then when that kind of wrapped up, I honestly needed a break. I was like, I can’t go into the food industry. Like hospitality is one of like the most demanding, tough industry. I gave like seven days a week of my life to that place, which I

loved and the person who owned it. And I had a beautiful relationship. So it was worth it. But I think I needed a break. And it took, I would say about 6 to 8 months before I was ready to dive back into the food space. And I honestly thought I was done with it. It was one of those moments where I was like, food and me done. Like I can enjoy it as a consumer or a punter at a place, but like not myself.

Until one of my friends was turning 30th and I essentially end up organizing her birthday and curating the menu and cooking and all of that. And then at the end of it, it felt so rewarding. What I realized is I love tangible results, and to see people really happy and, like bringing people together over food is like, I think the best

form of connection in my opinion. Yeah, Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And I think after that gave me that courage to be like, wait, you can you can do that. Cool. Also, it wasn’t 8 months. It was more than eight months. It was 12 months. I’m like time jumping right now. Good. I’m glad. Yes, 7-8 months like for. Hospital bed. I was worried, yeah. I I was just like, I really just skipped a whole year.

And I think after that I was like, hold on, I want to start something, you know, And in the era we live in, Instagram is the best platform to start anything. Hey, man. And I kind of was just like, I’m going to start a page and just like put things that I cook and make and share with people. And initially I had like 100 and 5200 followers. It was just like my friends who obviously support anything I do,

which is very sweet. And from there kind of started tablet guys because I needed a name for the page. And I was sitting there and I was like, OK, I’ll start with calling it tablet guys and I’ll pivot when I figure out a name. And to be honest, it’s been about 2 1/2 years and has not changed. I would, if you have a suggestion for new name, let me know. But I, I feel like the branding wise it’s sticking.

So absolutely. So that’s kind of like I would to the history of table at Kaya, yeah. Yeah, that’s great. And so and, but and the way that it looks now is like you’re popping up, is that right? Yes. So I think when I first initially started, I really didn’t know what direction I was going in. Like it wasn’t like a business idea. It was just like a little side

hobby. And I for a really long time I kept calling like my little business or like my side little thing and people like it’s a real business, you’ve done lots of things. And I was like, Oh yeah. So now I’m like really confident in backing the fact that it is, it is a business. It’s interesting though, because as someone who has a lot of experience in hospitality and knowing the overhead spend and cost and everything, I would

never fully dive into it in that sense. So in the last year, what I realized is I worked with a lot of small up and coming brands, small music artists in the inner W who wanted to combine music and food together and beverages as well. And so I’ve done a lot of events in more community spaces and then I’ve also done a lot of

like fundraiser style events as well. And I think for me, it’s actually that’s where it’s at, like interesting. Yeah, so, so less interested in like an actual brick and mortar and managing rent and electricity and more interested, it sounds like you’re saying in like this sort of connective thing between like an art experience and then like your body, like food stuff, you know,

yes, that’s, that’s interesting. So, so give us some examples of like of like, I don’t know, just give me like a drink or something that you would do join those two things. I think one of the exciting thing right now is I’m doing a collab with Angus, which is a cafe in Marrickville. Yeah, it’s on till end of this week. I don’t know when this podcast will come out, so until 1st of

March. Not me plugging that in. No, no, you’re plug away. Sorry, we produced it by day, so it. May come out, we didn’t say, but. Incredible. It may come out a little bit after that, but. For that collab, I think initially what it started off as 2 friends coming together and creating this menu and I had a lot of autonomy around putting on my items that I wanted to

have because it’s an influence of my Sri Lankan heritage, what I grew up eating. As well as there’s an item called Miso Chai, which is my influence from the Japanese restaurant that I managed. And I think looking back, it’s now we’re in the third week of this collab, is that I realized it was actually a form of activism.

And I’ll explain that. It’s a form of activism in the sense that I’m showcasing Sri Lankan heritage and cuisine to an audience that may have never tried or to people who have tried and to people who are of Sri Lankan descent that are trying and having this experience. I’ve had a lot of Sri Lankan friends come and say this is how

my mum used to make this, or this is what my mum or my siblings would have this on a Sunday and make this drink. And hearing those things made me realize, and I’m going to get emotional talking about it, but I think it made me realize it’s more than just as fun collab what it started off with. And I’m always very intentional. I think even when I say I’m going to do something fun, there’s always a purpose behind.

And I think I knew that, but I was trying to be really chill about it because I’ve had a really hectic last year with works. I wanted to do something fun and not put pressure. But in this process, I realized it is a form of activism, if you could say, and absolutely a way of educating people and bringing something to a space that people may not know and bringing people together over food, I would say.

Yeah, for sure. Yeah. I mean, like, I just think food is just such a powerful, like it’s sort of underrated as like as in that sense, like because we sort of see this world of culture, like, and we sort of think of like, yeah, paintings or like at the top or whatever. But I just feel like people really there’s this huge like amazing resonance with like food because it you know, it has this

connection to your body. Like you literally put it into your body. It’s so intimate and personal, but also everyone knows this experience of sharing food with people and it and it always everywhere, obviously across the world. It’s like that joke online you see of like someone going like in my culture we hate food and we don’t like family or whatever, you know what I mean?

Like everywhere. It’s just like it brings people together everywhere you go. And like there are different ways that it looks. But yeah, I just think it’s such a beautiful like sort of under considered thing that like you just have to put a little bit of effort in and suddenly you’re like having this amazing experience, you know, like. Yes. Yeah, so. So talk to us like one thing that I love, I like hosting, but

I’ve never really thought very much about the menu as part of the hosting thing. What about putting together a menu? Do you have any advice? For and, can I just add one thing to that as well with the menu? It’s also like, is there. I’m interested in the dish. Yeah.

Like the dish is one thing. Like I’m pretty good at putting together like a dish. Yeah. But then like thinking about like, I think it was Diana Henry. She’s a British food writer and she has this really cool book called How to Eat a Peach and the way that the. I I really want that book. Yeah. Yeah, it’s really, it’s got a really sweet, like furry Peach, like.

Yeah. But the way that the book is structured is in like menus, you know what I mean? It’s like a very, it’s like, yeah, entree main. Yeah, yeah. Which is a really sweet way of thinking about it. So I guess I’m interested. And it’s also beautiful because it’s such a simple concept, right? It’s like anything you have, you can make something out of it. And it’s stripping back this

idea of we need more and leaning into that consumerism as well. And like stripping back to like, whatever you have, you can make do with it if you’re creative enough. And if you think beyond that, oh, get a book like that and read. Read about it. Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, what’s your like? Yeah, for for this pop up for example. Yeah, what’s the thought where? Do you go? I am a big overthinker, like

well, overthinker. I was in, I don’t just go, hey, I’m going to do this and this is what it is. I have sat and brood on this for so long and I draw a lot of inspiration around me, within me and it’s always sitting there. So when I for example, with this pop up, this idea has been in the making for like 8 to 12 months already.

I just wanted to be in the right time for it to happen. When I say right time, I’m big on being very intentional. I was really busy last year so I couldn’t do this. But this year, at the beginning of this year, I’m like, you know, freelance life, it’s been slow that I’m like perfect. So it’s kind of hard to answer because I again, like I said, I

cook with my feelings and emotions. So therefore it kind of comes to me, and I know that’s a terrible answer because it’s really not helping people who don’t have that process and may have a different process, but other people have process where they look at cookbooks, right, and read ingredients. I can’t do that, but I admire that people can do that and then have their own take.

I read an ingredient or like a cookbook recipe and I’ll go, OK, I don’t have four of those things. I’m going to use whatever I have because I don’t want to go and buy that thing and then waste it. And I also don’t follow this step by step. I just go, that seems like something I know how to do and then I’ll it’s probably not the same thing. Don’t think I’m really answering your question because.

I think about this with like, cuz yeah, I guess in a way it’s kind of like it elevates but also like undermines food when like cuz when you were speaking before Matt, I was thinking about food almost as a medium, yes, which almost has this. Something I’m not happy about with that cuz it’s more

beautiful than a medium. Yeah. But I always feel like with any artistic medium, so much of the work is in like, yes, you might have your intentions or your concepts or your philosophy or what you would like to achieve with this thing, but it’s in the making and the time spent, yes, in this case with the cooking and chopping and. Testing. And then the sort of themes, if

you will arise from, yeah, spending so much time with your medium. Yeah, and you’re right there with the cooking and the chopping because at that time for me, it’s like a place of, I mean, depending when you’re asking me if I’m hosting or like catering for an event, it’s always stressful because there’s a deadline. There’s, you know, a financial thing behind it, but if it’s like for friends, it’s kind of like a grounding experience for

me. And it’s something so intentional and one that like in this time in our lives, especially as a producer, I’m like always go, go, go. Like there is not a moment to stop and kind of like experience what you’re doing. I’m try and do that, but it’s really hard when you’re working in media agencies and creative agencies with hectic deadlines to really enjoy each moment.

So something as cooking for me is the moment to like be intentional, like understand the ingredients I’m using and like be essentially grateful for what we also have. Like having that moment to reflect and be like, wow, this. We live in such a lush, lavish life to be able to do this as well. It’s insane. Sometimes I’m just like, how did I eat this?

Like, like, you know, Matt and I always say damn, like we’re eating so good. Like, yes, I mean, it’s not an abnormal week. You know, it’s like, you know, we’re not buying truffles and it’s just the standard stuff in in this country. Is just absolutely, we’re so lucky our produce. It’s almost too much sometimes. I agree it’s overwhelming ‘cause then you’re like, I wanna do

this and this, but you just don’t have the time of the day. True. And it’s, it’s even like, I don’t know what to cook, ‘cause I get in there and it’s like, everything’s in season. Yeah, all the meat’s like, great. And it’s just like, I don’t. Yeah. Do you have any dietary preferences? Do you eat me to? No, I don’t. I’m so lucky again. I’ve been thinking about this a lot recently.

Just the fact that I don’t have any dietary requirements and I can’t eat everything. And even things like growing up I didn’t love tomatoes, but now I’ve as an adult I’m like try that again. And I do like tomatoes. It’s kind of like amazing reintroducing things that you don’t like and like liking it in different ways, or like just realizing things are differently cooked actually taste better.

Incredible tomato redemption story? Yeah. Yeah, there’s like a funny thing where I’m like when someone says they don’t like something, like I don’t like tofu or mushrooms. Like I’m like part of me is like, I bet I can make it yes, But then part of me is like has to also accept yes, like if they don’t like. It it’s a two way street, right? They’re willing to be like, OK, I want experiences in a new way, but. You don’t want to push them too hard.

Like, you have to try my tomato soup. Like, that’s funny. Can we go back a little bit to this kind of cooking style that you have? And I think a lot of like, I think I cook in this way as well. I think a lot of like, people who are comfortable in the kitchen learn to cook this way, which I would like describe as very intuitive. Yeah. Like a recipe for me is not so

useful. It stresses me out. It’s so stressing. You know what, sorry not to jump in. You know what’s really frustrating? Why do they do the ingredients and then the step by step separately? Why don’t you go step one, add like whatever it is to marinade, like and tell me that how much like, you know, add paprika, like 20 grams. I mean, don’t add 20 grams of paprika, but like that like the back and forth.

And then like, because I think how most people and I don’t know, maybe it’s like the Western world of cooking is they’ll say like what the ingredients are and you put in a little ramekins and dishes, but I’m like, that’s just a lot of waste of washing things later. Oh my God. So it really sorry. This is just like my biggest frustration is that they don’t make it easy. And maybe that’s something that I should do this year, like

wait. There you go. Don’t tell. No idea. Don’t tell them my secret. Oh shit, the. First good recipe. I mean, recipe Tin eats her recipes. No, she’s, I will say she’s amazing, Yeah. She’s fantastic, yeah. Yeah. So I guess like, and some people when I’m cooking, they feel frustrated because they want someone who’s less comfortable in the kitchen.

They think that they want the like really specific. It’s like, is this cooked? How much of this is this going to work? Is that going to work? And then you have to give the really frustrating, like, doesn’t like work like that? Like it’s kind of vibe did. You see how you until it gets brown or like. Yeah, yeah. So it’s interesting, the recipe. I will say it’s hard with me. I’ve definitely got in bed over

the years, but my friends used to not love being in the kitchen with me because I’m like, I watch them like dice an onion and it stresses me out. And then I essentially like mansplain how to dice an onion to them. Me too. And they’re just like, OK, is this good? So it makes sense when it’s good enough. Is this good enough? No, literally happy. Now, yeah, it’s such a horrible

feeling when you like you want to like your child and you want them to grow. Literally I’m like, I see potential. No. And then they I feel like I’m actually just stressing them out and they’re like, yeah, I can’t cook with you around. And then I’m. Like, no, sometimes I feel like I’m Gordon Ramsay, but like. You know. Growing pots and pairs. Literally. I see. So much potential in you just so

that out start again some. Onions the other day and I was like sitting on the other side of the kitchen and I was just looking at how high the gas was. Yeah, like after a while I came over and I just added some water into the pan and turned the thing down. She’s like, I know it was too hot from the beginning and I was. Like, Oh my God, I do the thing where now I let them chop the onion and then when they walk away to go to the bathroom or

something I like fine, like dice. It’s it’s all because The thing is it’s all not going to cook in the same, you know? Yeah. No, we, we got you. Yeah, we got you. Good. Yeah, Yeah. That’s interesting. The recipe is interesting. A food writer that I like from the UK, Tom Eagle talks about like the recipe as the oldest form of food writing in a way.

And it’s funny because it’s, it’s this beautiful historical document. And then now it’s also become this kind of. Everyday practice. Yeah, and also like quote, UN quote, cool cooks will be like recipes are lame, like. Generally, you know what I mean. Are you calling me a cool cooker? I mean, yeah. You’re a cool cooker. You definitely got that. Yeah, you know, you are.

But yeah, I guess I’ve also been interested in this genre of like, I guess they call it food writing. Yeah, but it’s not recipes. No, I was thinking it like doesn’t have a section in the bookshop like quite like sometimes really in the essays section. Yeah, yeah. Or it’s like short stories collection of Yeah. But this, this feeling of like, there’s like Ruby Tando, MFK Fisher, Tom Eagle, where it’s

like, like Tom Eagle has this book called First Catch Study of a Spring meal. And it’s this really meandering, like kind of pretentious. Yeah, you know, philosophical thing. And then the recipes almost like intertwined. This is so interesting. Yeah. You know what I mean? Because I’ve been reading. Someone actually gave me this book because I was saying how I want to become a writer.

And it’s something that I think any form of creativity I’m happy to share. But writing’s one thing. I feel really personal and close and I’m scared. And it was actually a gold mine by end of this summer to like publish in the sense like put on my social media or like publish through a media agency. But we’ll get back to that. But a friend gave me this book and I think it’s called New York’s Bestseller. It’s like little short stories,

collections from I think newspapers and whatnot. And one of them is called Smelly Box, Smelly lunch box. And I don’t know if you guys heard of it, but it’s different segments of different immigrant stories of kind of how they, I think it’s like overcame a form of bullying through food or, you know, experiences of food. And I read one of them and

actually drew inspiration for me to write something that is really beautiful. Don’t know if I’m ready to share that here, but I can give you a little glimpse into it. But it essentially talks a lot around like food being the key in bringing humanity back to people. I was born in Sri Lanka. I was born in the war. And there’s a lot of, like, you know, what’s the word, like,

disconnect to different groups of people. But this story that I’m writing essentially talks a lot about how even in this hardest times, there’s a glimpse of hope because food is what kind of brings people together. And this collection of short stories was amazing because I felt like when I was reading, it evoked a lot of emotions for me

to then feel like I could go and write this as well. Yeah. You absolutely should do that. Yeah, yeah, yeah, totally. I mean, I think, yeah, I love the idea of people writing like, even if it’s just like a simple recipe, like, because obviously those, those writings that you’re talking about, Aiden, are like quite a bit more like work goes into it than just like jotting down ingredients and

methods. But yeah, just anything like I’m, I’m a big, like I’m a photographer and I’m a big recorder of things. And like now that I’ve been doing it for so long, going back like even three years ago to like, what did we do for New Year’s Eve? Like just the, the record of things. It’s so beautiful to have the tree rings of your life. Like, yeah, a very strong encouragement from the pod to

like, I mean. Think of the like emotional difference between like, I want to make sauerkraut and you just like look it up. And of course there’s a trillion sauerkraut recipes. But then it’s like, oh, my friend made sauerkraut. Like what’s your sauerkraut? Yeah, which is more special, right, Because you have a connection to this person. Often when you get a recipe from

a family member or a friend. True. Yeah. And it’s like this isn’t, I’m not making sauerkraut. I’m like making, you know? Yeah, Asian sauerkraut. Mad sauerkraut. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So. Exciting. You got a recipe? No, I was actually gonna say like I remember this was like this would have been in like COVID good times. Aiden and I have known each other for a long time, but this this was like I think COVID or like it was a while ago, but I

still remember you giving me a jar of piccalilli. Do you remember the piccalilli that you made sure? What’s a? Piccalilli I. Put so much work into it. It’s like an English or you describe. It, I mean, yeah, it’s popular in England. I don’t actually exactly know so much about it, but it’s got it’s like a bunch of different fermented veg. Like I did like little onions

and you put like some broccoli or cauliflower. Yeah. And I think I it goes like this yellowy. So there must be some sort of. Maybe it’s turmeric. Yeah, actually my roommate just pickled a bunch of things and there’s one of them that looks a bit yellow. Yeah, so. And it, it goes like it’s classic, like all these pickled things. It kind of goes like, you know, ham, cheese, pickle. Wait, there’s ham cheese in it

when you’re assembling that would be, I was like, you’re pickling ham and cheese. That’s where you would see. OK, I’m like a ham and cheese sandwich. Yeah, it’s it’s an English interpretation of Indian Pickles popular popularised in the mid 18th century. Of course it is, yeah. Yeah. Literally. Yeah. Yeah. What are these spices in there? Is it? I will tell you the ingredients, vegetables, cauliflower florets, cauliflower flower, zucchini,

but a lot of work. Yeah, a lot of work because it was. Sounds delicious. Though Yeah, yeah. Mustard powder. Gorge. Turmeric. Mustard. Yeah. Thickening turmeric. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Mustard seeds. Mustard seeds, cumin, coriander, ginger, cumin. Yeah. It’s beautiful, all the classic, like, yeah, super fragrant, flavourful, yeah. Yeah, I mean, that was that was like that was such a core food memory for me because it was

this like and it was just. I have a picture of it on my old Hyundai Getz. Like it was just on top of the car. We like, I don’t know, emptying our pockets and yeah, just the sight of this like jar of piccaloo and, you know, you’d made enough for a few different jars, so everyone got one or whatever. But yeah, just that sight of like the gift of like a fermented thing that you’d put all this work into was just

like, so I still think about that jar today. You know, it was like a reused peanut butter jar or something. But it’s. It’s always a. Reused jar. Motherfucker hasn’t made it for me since I’ll. See how my fermenting game, but I did just do a. Sound What is your current cooking era? I’m getting back into it. It’s pretty bad at the moment. Like it’s, it’s more practical

than it’s ever been. So I’ve had times in my life where I am cooking and shopping so much that it’s my entire life. You know what I mean? I’m like at the market every day. Everything’s about what’s for dinner and I’m like, holy shit, I am cooking and cleaning like almost full time. So now we’re in a bit of a sadder place.

I love going to the farmers market. I really really struggle with. Do you go to the Addison Rd. one or? I go to Orange Grove at the moment in Roselle. OK. I was like, where’s orange? Yeah, I do love the Roselle markets, but I don’t think I’ve ever been to the farmers one. It’s very cute, it’s very cool. Where do you do your yeah? I go to the Marrickville Asian grocer.

It is amazing. Everything’s so. Fresh on Illawar. Road there’s like 3. My favorite 1 is in the middle. Yeah. Because the ladies yell at me sometimes because I go and ask I’m like, do you have this? Because like, no, no, girl, no, no. Girl. She’s so sassy, but I love it. And then, and then she’ll laugh, laugh with me about something and. Then I’m like vibe. She’s laughing at you, but

that’s OK. Well. Sometimes I’m laughing at her too and she doesn’t. They have these things. I don’t know what it is. It’s like a, it almost looks like a little doughnut and then it has pork and I think it’s like the sort of fungus Y mushroom. They have them just like in a big plastic tub with a little like fly net over the top and

they’re like 3 bucks at the. Front. Wait I haven’t had that. Is it a doughnut? Is a Dome shaped. It’s yeah. No, it’s not a doughnut, but they do have a sweet version. It’s like a try sphere, Yeah. Yeah, sphere. It’s and it’s kind of like, is it gluttonous? Yes, exactly. Yes, it’s like a gluttonous. I’m pretty sure it’s like a gluttonous ball. That’s what I’m Yum Chuck. That’s what they got in this.

Ball. It’s a gluttonous ball. It’s fucking delicious though, and I love the idea of like, that’s just not done here. No, you’re not getting that at Woolies. No, these are the ones from this morning. That’s my favorite thing. Every time I go there, I’m doing my like, to be honest, grocery shopping there is my happy place. Yeah. Like for the last week, I haven’t been able to walk, but when I can, I go. And I’m just like, I’m just so happy to be here that I forget

that I’ve just been here for half an hour for no reason. It’s the. Most amazing shop is it the one that I’m thinking of it’s quite like compressed yeah and it’s got like yes, yeah, yeah, and it’s just. So you got the first one when you’re walking towards Hill Rd. then you got, I think bread top and then it’s the one after bread top, the one in the middle. They’re all great, but all great. Yeah. No, that’s, but the middle 1 is

like my favorite one. That’s such AI. And my favorite thing is like, I check out, there’ll be like a box of like Rumbatan. I don’t know if, you know, it’s a very tropical, like South Asian fruit or they’ll have a lot of South Asian different fruits like lychee, Rumbatan, mangosteen. And so I just go wait. I’ll just grab a handful and I just, you know, I get to go home, eat it or share with people. And it’s just, again, like you said, it’s not experiences you

can get from the big corpse. Yeah, who? I hope they die. Don’t even get me I Oh my God, I keep fucking to go. They need to. Go there. I’m not gonna like shame. People. Yeah, true. Actually, those people need to go ‘cause they’ll take over the issue. Gross. And I don’t want that. Yeah, true. True, but yeah, it is. It’s very funny ‘cause like sometimes you do the like the double, like people go to like

Harris farm in like art, like for fruit and veg and they go upstairs for like toilet paper and whatever. So you see the same people in the cold and just the like psychological experience of being in such a, I mean, Harris farms getting bigger. But like you used to do this math, like the planograms, like how corporatized, like you know

with the layout. Yes, yeah. And. It’s just shocking from like Harris Farm, which is pretty toned down, yeah, to like, whoa, I’m in a place that where every centimetre of this shopping. Details. And price. And yes, it’s just like, I mean, I’m so sensitive I’m like, Oh my God, yeah. Having a panic attack just from. Did you guys know that the reason milk is always all the

way at the back at Coles and Woolies is so that intentionally you have to walk through the aisles and shop for other things? Yeah, this is yeah. Yeah. So a planogram for our audience is, is the sort of spec of the way they lay out the shelves. And like, I don’t know if you knew this audience, but every single shelf you have to pay a certain fee.

If you’re a Sunrise, for example, you have to pay a certain. Fee I didn’t know that at a certain height so there’s premium like hotspot where it. Gets deeper than this. They they do. I used to work in market research for this. It goes right. Of course, you didn’t matter how many lives you’ve lived. I’ve lived a lot of lives and for example, this is a best 1. You know, if you go to the confectionery’s aisle, for example, the like, say Mars will

pay a premium to be a child’s eye height. Shut. Up and same with cereals. Like sweet cereals, they’re a child’s eye height. You know, wait up and goes always like a teenager height. Like it’s like the 10:10 to 11:00 plus. Exactly. Yeah. Teenage boy. Yeah, the links at Teenage Boy Hut. So where should we be shopping?

Like which height of shelf is there? OK, so if you’re, if you’re just going for Max value at Woolworths, this is another crazy food like deep industry thing. The the people that make the the cheapest thing in a, in a, a bulk segment, like for example, rice is a good one. I I hope this isn’t an industry

secret that I’m going to get assassinated. For who’s coming for you? Sunrise, they have a deal with Woolworths where OK, we get a certain amount of space on the planogram. It might be a bigger space, but like lower down, let’s say, but it’s it’s thought of as the cheapest section because it’s at the it’s on the floor,

literally. But in exchange and like maybe for free, we get that in exchange, we give you the packaging and the facilities to produce your home brand rice. So the home brand is exactly the same rice, same crops, same farmers, same factory, same packaging, just different like images on the packaging as whoever the the dominant like

you’ll see like sunrise has a huge fucking. Yeah, yeah. So, yeah, I mean, these were incredibly scientific surveys that we were doing that were just like I was fucking. This is really funny because then you go to the Asian grocer and you’re like, can’t find the most simple thing because it’s in some random aisle underneath something, and you’re asking the lady and she’s just getting angry at you for, like, not seeing it.

Yeah. So funny, yeah. Although like you can if you learn one layout, a lot of the time you can go to any Woolworths in the country and they’re all the fucking same like. Mad. OK, I’m one of those people. When someone tells me information like this, which I love, I can’t Unsee it and it’s forever imprinted. So now I’m gonna go and every time I go to Woolly, so calls, I’m gonna be like, so like aware of this.

Such a crazy I don’t. I mean, you may get to the point of like eye tracking, right? Like they’re. So that was, yeah, that was the market. I’ll see how much I can say about it. But basically, like there, there was this job I had where we were like doing market research of people entering A Woolworth.

So you would get a certain reward and in exchange, like literally just cash in exchange. You wear these glasses. Yeah, purely voluntary. We wouldn’t force anyone and. We didn’t force. Anyone and you would do your shop as normal and then you hand the glasses back and they had recorded. Study. They had recorded your eye movements and where they landed.

Oh my God. So in terms of like what’s the term planet plan? A planogram, yeah. So, OK, so you’ve looked at the top shelf, you’ve looked across, but then you’ve gone for the cheaper option, but you were interested in that product. Exactly. Yeah, like the Coke rebrand. And so it’s a kind of to also then say maybe the not that wool isn’t called is going to do this, but they’re like, we should bring the price down because people are looking into product but not buying it like

not that they’ll ever bring the price down. You know, like, I mean, we never were Privy to any of those decisions. I think that’s like fully internal. Like, you know, we were dealing with Kohl’s and Woolworths and then like people like Mars and you know, you. Need all the small you know. Whatever. Like big food things, crazy stuff. I just. Call them small, they’re big. Oh yeah, they’re big. Yeah, they’re big. King size.

Yeah, and like local. Farmers, yeah. It’s an, it was an incredible world to see behind the. I love it because it was just like, and I mean, like, I’ve, you know, I was ranting about this last night, but it’s like this stuff goes in my body. I literally absorb it into my body. Like I will not go to the fucking Kohl’s to buy a tomato ever in my life unless I fucking

have to, unless I don’t have any problem with people that do that. I think it’s fine. I just hate the the, the association between food and thriftiness. Like in that sense of like, I’m going to get the cheapest possible tomato. It’s like it’s going into. France as well. That bugs me so much. Yeah. I did a bit of hospital when I was a kid, yeah. And I thought I wanted to be a chef and I worked with this

amazing chef, but I just couldn’t handle it. I just knew I couldn’t handle it. And I met like, like my uni job was at Bespoken Grind, which is still going, which is beautiful. And the chef there now. Where is it again? It’s. In Marrickville. On Marrickville Road. Is that the opposite? Marrickville Park. Yeah, opposite. Oh my God, yes, you know that. Place is so good, yeah, and she’s an incredible.

Chef, I’m pretty sure I keep. Someone keeps telling me it’s one of her friend’s mums. Yes, who runs it, And I just don’t know why. I can never remember who it is. Yeah, that makes sense. Anyways, if any of the listeners listen, please let me know it. Was just this incredible experience and I kept running into like the beauty or I did. I’ve done like a bit of time at one another in Newtown and I just, I’m like, I’m learning so much just from, you know, I was

a barista. I wasn’t in the kitchen, but just like seeing, yeah, how you think of a dish. And so I always got a lot out of that. I was like, I wish I could just come into like all these kitchens like once a month and learn like. But observing so many different skills and so many different processes. Yeah. And the way you guys do it is, yeah, but I just knew I wasn’t cut out for it like. Oh, same here.

I did. I have a set two or three in cooking like so I could have been a chef and I did like a few experiences and I was like, this is so demanding and it’s so male dominated as well. Yeah. I mean, I don’t know if it’s like super male dominated now, but it’s still in terms of the hierarchy for the head chefs and whatnot and just felt so toxic. I was like, I couldn’t do that it. Absolutely is.

I mean even though it’s like gotten better in quotes, it still has such a head. Over, yeah, I think certain people have made sure that it’s a healthier spaces, but yeah, I just feel like not the mass. I agree. Yeah. So I mean, yeah, I was thinking about something. I mean, we can talk about. I’ve got a couple of questions, but it really bugs me when people are going to restaurants and I just got the wrong idea

about price. It’s like this obsession with cheap eats and what that means. And it’s like, I wish you just knew a little bit about the economy. Yeah, and what and how much produce cost? Especially if you want people to be paid, you know, like 35 bucks an hour. Like we should be here. Like at least like I. Don’t know. I always find it so interesting. It’s the people who are like, we

care about, you know, people and like their wages and their rights. And then they’re still not wanting to pay, you know, over a certain amount. But it’s like, well, how do you think? First of all, hospitality is a really tough industry with the overhead, the labor cost, the, you know, the cost of ingredients, all of that. And then there’s also so much around council permits. So like, it’s not cheap.

So when you’re going out and eating like, yes, we want to have a decent meal with a decent price point, but you also have to be realistic that that’s just not possible. Especially if you want it to be like cute and trendy and Instagrammable and like, there’s just so much work that goes into it and the overheads are like, you just make nothing on the plate of whatever, you know? Yeah, and I guess it’s like the

art. It’s like the in the art world, it’s like you see an abstract. You’re like, I could have done that. It’s like I could have cooked this fucking. Thing. Yeah, and it’s like maybe. Yeah, when they look at like a like a greens or like a vegetable that’s cooked with some oyster. So like I could have done that. It’s like, well, why haven’t you? Like it still takes time you stuff to go buy the ingredients. And even if you could, you could do it for one or two or three

people, not 200 people a night. Yes, and you’re not paying fucking rent in Sydney and you’re not paying self and you’re not paying. Lighting and people don’t think about things like electricity. It is so expensive. And a restaurant, it’s running 24/7. It’s. Like the vegetables cost that much because the meat needs to cost this much and you don’t want to pay. So yeah, that infuriates me.

This is interesting because people often ask me like, will I open, you know, something like a cafe, a restaurant, and my aunts is immediately always know I’m like, as someone who managed a restaurant, I didn’t own it, but I was so close to knowing every aspect of that business. I just don’t think it’s ever worth opening restaurant. I think the closest I would get

to is like a wine bar with like a four like a four item menu. Literally. But that sounds like fun. Yeah, we’ve been talking about, we’ve been talking about doing one of those for. Well, maybe we should all ruin this together, because to be honest, Sydney needs that. Like a really cute wine bar that is not pretentious. It’s not just wanker, it’s just. Good yummy pause this Yeah,

we’re. Gonna go business meeting yeah, first whip we. Got to the point of it even looking at properties in Ashfield like next to like prop gallery. It’s like it could become a little like corner. You love that people go to New Shanghai and then come to the wine bar or BYO your food that. Was. The idea it’s. Wait, shut up. It’s like BYO food.

I know. Actually it was the opposite. We weren’t going to BYO drinks to get. Around the license. This is our idea and if. Anyone wants a wine bottle? No, no, wait, let me, let me, let me pitch it to you. So it’s like this is our idea. It’s like, you know, you get a place and then you get one of those like shady sort of gallery style licenses. But what you’re doing is like, like, you know, to make it legal

so that people can drink. You just bring like bags of Lays chips in, you know, and then it’s like there is pooping soap and they’re on a plate. Boom, you know, like on a nice silver. But then like, I brought my like bottle of plank to just like smash with my friends. It’s. So that’s one idea. Yeah, we really need that space. And it’s unfortunate because

wine bars demographically, like I just went to Saint Eloise in Potts Point and like. Not I like wait decent Eloise yeah yeah, my favorite place I. Really like it but I went last time and maybe it was just the night or whatever but the vibes were just a little too old and rich. Yes, no 100. I mean, it’s also in POTS point,

right? As it is, and like, I’m not, you know, in POTS point, I get what I’m given, but I think I went there probably a few years ago. We went and had a bottle of wine like at lunchtime and it just felt so perfect. It’s just so fun. I had the same experience. I used to love it and I when I said I loved it, I realized I actually haven’t been there in a while. Yeah. Went there, Hips, similar experience. Beautiful.

Like outdoor seating. It’s just such a vibe. And then the last time I went, it did feel, I felt a bit out of place. Yeah. And I mean, I did go on Valentine’s Day last year, but still, I was like, oh, OK, like, this is nice. Like it. It didn’t give me the same feeling. Yeah. And I just, I just want a place where we can just sit and enjoy

and everyone’s laughing, Everyone’s having fun. I mean, this one really happened in Sydney. But like even sitting on like the curbside off the street and just very European, you know, like I just. Want Asia to Yeah, yeah, I love that idea. Very much about appreciating the like the drink, but not having to know what the drink is like. I’m sick of being like, well,

have you had this drink before? It’s like, well, no, can you tell me? Like, that’s why I’m here. And they talk about, you know, the region and what? And I’m like, I don’t care. Is it yummy? Is it funky? Is it a bit zesty? Like, is it fruity? Like tell me the things that I can understand. Like I’ve been drinking wine and I know enough about wine, but even then I don’t give a fuck. Yeah. Of the region like I do to an extent. Like I love S Australian wine.

I always will say it’s the best place in Australia to get wine. Or Victoria. Yeah, but I don’t know, we just need a place where someone could just get. Yeah, that’s a. Pretentious drink. I mean, I think like I’ve been I I I do read a fair bit of like a boomer media and there’s one thing this the big story in boomer food right now is wine is dying.

Like there’s no more no one’s drinking wine anymore. Like everyone’s crying about how the wine is dying and it’s like, I mean, it’s, it’s not going. I think it’s. Not wine dying. I think people are choosing to not drink and there’s more of a comfortable, safe space for people to not drink. Absolutely, Which is so valid and something that should have happened a long time ago. But I don’t think it’s just wine. I think it’s overall the alcohol industry is deteriorating.

Yeah, yeah. But one I think is maybe good for us. Yeah, I think that’s fine. I think like you, you need to shake things up. Otherwise it’s just, it will. It will die. Yeah. Yeah, it will die. And it’s very cyclical. Watch it come back like the the industry will be fine, you know, in like another 5 to 10 years. I mean, yeah, wine. Because I, yeah. So I started in coffee. And in coffee, people like hate

you. They’re like, shut up. I know more about coffee. And my give. Me my fucking coffee. And you’re like, but it’s a single origin. And I read the heaps about coffee and we care about it so much. And then I started working in, like, some wine bars. Yeah. And it just completely flipped. See, I knew nothing about wine. I was like 20 fucking three. Yeah. And just cuz I was in this fucking cool, scary wine bar, Yeah.

All these people became so deferent, like, oh, what do you know about wine? And you’re like, I know nothing. But like, fuck it. Like it was enough. Yeah. I was like, if I really didn’t know and some dude came in that like knew a lot about wine, I’d be like, why don’t you taste it? Like that was always the need to. Fall back on everything. Going to wine bar is you clearly know the person.

It’s like their first day of second day. They know nothing about wine, but they’re trying their best. I’m like, because you’re trying give me whatever you’re saying, I’ll take it. Just put the fries in the bag they. Get super flustered like whatever. But yeah, they’re working in wine is cool. I think it’s in a good spot, yeah, in terms of that. But yeah, it’s always hard

because it’s like it makes sense economically as well because like even if we go there, we buy 1 bottle of wine and we’re like no food please. But then these fucking rich older people are like, yeah, I’ll have. The Yeah, the. Veins and the cheese course. And so like, yeah, it’s OK. I’m not mad at them for going that way. Yeah, because you know what? Someone needs to keep the economy going and let them.

Totally. Yeah, it seems like a different cycle. Of like then a new place open it just. Also, you’ll get to a point at that age as well where you’ll be spending that much money Exactly I. Fucking hope so. I do feel like there’s this, there’s has been this like big change and and like it’s kind of they’re also alongside them slackening some of those draconian like alcohol laws.

But I do feel like I see, you know, a cute little record bar and it’s wine and small plates of things like popping up a lot more in Sydney now, which I’m super hopeful about. That’s what we’ve been talking about, right? It’s like a small unpretentious bar that’s like, it’s not the pub, but it’s not like a fancy. Fancy it’s in between, which is why, and this is something I don’t know I’m still feeling

like I’m not sure how I feel about all of this but supper club right it’s a beautiful thing because it’s creating a unique experience I. Don’t know what that is. You don’t know what that is. OK Supper Club is essentially to define that. A gathering of people over food at unique spots. It’s usually pop up. It’s not necessarily always the same food. There’s a lot of up and coming Sydney based.

What would you call them? Cooks, chefs, depending on your title, creating these spaces. I’ve been to few, I’ve hosted few. Mine is not necessarily supper club. Mines more like gathering. I don’t know, I kind of hated the term supper club at one point ‘cause it felt like everyone was just calling everything supper club and it lost its meaning. Yeah, which is the same club we’re having.

We’re having cakes Supper club. Yeah, but it’s the same way I feel about community. I feel like there’s a point. And even now I feel a bit exciting community because it lost its meaning when people used overused, like big corporations were using the word community. I’m like, this is not a community. This is your audience. This is your target audience. It’s different. Oh my God, don’t let me get started on this. But supper club is essentially

gathering over food and, you know, paired with wine and it’s usually long table styled nicely. People in New York do it in their like, apartments. You can do it in like like taking over a restaurant and calling it supper club, warehouse spaces, whatever it is. So we’ve had heaps in the last couple of years. I would say a la Camino were

kind of the first guys to do it that I knew of about four years ago. So they these two dudes who are now across New York and Europe and Australia. But when they first started, they were Sydney based. And so that was really cool to see them do that. And then since then, a lot more people are doing it, a lot more women are doing it, women of color.

And that’s just been really incredible. There’s a girl named Table Talk. She does Bengali food and it’s just incredible. She’s, I think she’s got one lab with Kolkata, which is the paid forward guys who do what they do is they bring in, Oh my God, sorry, I’ve just blanked. They bring in people who have just recently come to Australia

with no job skills, and they upskill them through any sort of hospitality spaces. Yeah. So anyway, so it’s really awesome to see kind of food shape in a different way in Sydney and make it fun. Especially since COVID, with a lot of our favorite restaurants going under, our favorite wine bars and even pubs. I think it’s been so nice to see this space that is cultivated by

the people, for the people. God I hate saying that, but it makes sense. I’m looking for my favorite Ursula Le Guin quote about this. OH. My God, yes. Yeah, I really like that. And I guess it just makes it there’s an accessibility there, right? Accessibility and I think it’s also what’s so beautiful. It’s, it’s communities of people that are in that space. And then slowly it expands,

right. So therefore, it’s not like a restaurant opening and you get this mixed bag, which we were talking about with DS and Eloise. Please let us in. We, we love that place. Is that you’re kind of curating the vibe and the people that are coming through. Not saying that it’s exclusive, but it’s your friends and friends of friends. So you know what the vibe is going to be, You know what

you’re experiencing. Yeah. Yeah, awesome. Right, I’ve nearly got. It he’s nearly. Got it. He’s nearly got it. I’ve got this, you guys. It’s funny. I just had it on my phone. Wait, I it’s in the screenshots folder because I posted it to my story because I thought it was so pretty. Here she is. She says what goes too long unchanged destroys itself. The forest is forever because it

dies and dies, and so it lives. Oh my God, I love that. Gorgeous. That’s. Beautiful. Have you read any Ursula? No, but I would love to. Who is she? Is she like a writer? She was a a really cool she did a lot of like essays, but and like lots of writing about writing fiction. But her big works are a fantasy

series. It’s because of three and then a later, much later on a four book, like she added a fourth book series called the Earthsea Trilogy and then quota, which is what that is from. I think that’s like a wise character is saying that. And then she’s also done some like really clever and like very inventive science fiction books.

I’ll see if I have one to show you in the 70s as well, 70s and 80s that like really do this the most amazing, like reimagining different shapes that societies can take on and really fucking cool experimenting with gender stuff like way back then and such A she’s such a cool. She’s a real favorite of mine. My mum introduced me to her because that fantasy.

I love. Her bag back in the day. I only read things that are sad and depressing like Sylvia Plath so. We fucking love. Sylvia, I know. Did you? Do the bell jar. That one’s very sad, that book. Oh no I haven’t I it’s on my list. I’ve had to stop reading sad books because I was just like always sad because I was reading sad books. Like currently I’m reading Crying in H Mart and before that

I was reading on Earth. We were briefly gorgeous and they’re both mirroring off like an immigrant experience lost and grieve. And I’m like, why am I doing this to myself? Yeah. Yeah, I have a lot of sad books that are piling up that people keep giving me. Sad and beautiful. No, I was saying people are like you, you’d like this. I’m like, no, actually I’m kind of wanting something happier I’ll need. A break.

That’s cool. I got a couple more questions that are just coming to mind. One is sort of more practical. I actually bumped into my chefy friend on the bus on the way here and she was saying like I was like, do you have any questions? Do you have any questions? Like a Bella cookie cook? Who? Is your Chevy friend. Her name? Isabella. Hi, Isabella.

Abella. Abella, sorry. So this is from her. It was about like the practicalities of working in like heaps of different kitchens and potentially with heaps of different people because I’m always so interested in like, yeah, how the hell do you get this manufacturing line, the home? Cooking. It’s hard one.

Of the time and we make so much mess and that’s for four people what I mean so I. Would love This is such an interesting question, one that a lot of people don’t think so for a really long time. And I still do cook a lot of my for whether it’s events, catering from home and on a small scale, like you said, cooking about up to four people is possible with your home kitchen.

Anything more you forget the task of like, like say, for example, I remember for one of the 1st events we did, it was called Insufferable Girl Breakfast, which is key. We’re raising money for the women’s shelter. And what were you wearing? And anyways, I was making onigiri, right? I had to make, I think about 80

to 90 servings of onigiri. But you know what the hardest part was cooking rice, taking it out, washing it, cooking rice because I can only make, I think about four to five cups of rice in my small rice cook at a tie. And that task took it out of me. And then like that was hard. And then molding it into those little triangles like that was OK because at least I was able

to sit down. But it’s the cooking, washing, cooking, washing, finding containers to put this rice, letting it cool. I had to mix it then with like, vinegar. It’s so time consuming. And people just don’t realize when they’re eating it that they’re like, oh, all of this time had gone into creating this. Yeah. So there’s that element. And then there’s also the

element of, like, being in different kitchen spaces and not knowing your bearing and like, being like, walking, like thinking this is where the utensils are going to be. Or like asking, like, where’s the chopping board? Like just being inconvenienced to people in this space. Sure. So it is it’s so interesting because that element is hard. The people element not so much. And I’ll say it’s because on my day job, I freelance as a

producer, so I’m constantly every week, every day I’m meeting different people. So I’m so used to that and it’s I don’t even really think about that, but it it can be hard still. It’s quite daunting in the kitchen space because you don’t know what the atmosphere is and people have their ways and chefs have their spaces and you can’t really just go in and be like, I’m going to use this bench space. They’re like, no, no, no, that’s

the frying station or that’s the like. So there, there is all of that. But I think one thing that I feel like I’m good at is that my relationship with people aren’t transactional. I will always make sure to build a relationship and it’s not something that I do it intentionally. It just happens. And so therefore it often in these scenarios makes it easy

because I’ve either already had an established some sort of relationship ongoingly for years or weeks, or I’ve come in and I’ve made myself feel very comfortable, made them feel comfortable that, you know, they’re able to help me in these spaces. Yeah. So I do think it’s a lot about people connection as well as well. Yeah, that’s beautiful. That’s such a cool story. And also like you’ve, I’d love

to know how this whole experience was. You’ve been like in some like fairly well known, like media hits like recently, like, you know, we would, we would love to just like, just like get if you could give us the like inside scoop of what that looks like, you know, because many of us would dream of being on Sunrise. This was television. Morning show actually. Did you know the difference?

I don’t know the difference. I don’t watch TV, so I don’t. Don’t worry. Yeah, Did I? So sunrise is literally sunrise. It’s 5:00 AM, and then the morning show is I think it’s 10 AM. So that’s the difference, right? This is so funny because I feel like since I’ve been on every friend I’ve seen, like even yesterday I had dinner in Asheville. Well, now you can just point them to this be.

Like please. Refer to. Like I was experience and I I feel like I’ve become a politician in the sense I’m really good at rego entertaining the same information the. Trot out the same talking. Point Yeah, and I’m like, I get it why politicians become soulless because by like the 50th time of telling the story, you have nothing. Anyways, no, I really appreciate you asking me this. No shape, right?

Nice. Well, OK, so the beautiful thing is I have worked in media for so long, at least the last, I would say four years. And in the four years again like I said, I cultivate relationship with any place I work in or any connections and people. So the morning show is really interesting because I was out with a friend for another

friend’s birthday and he now works at 7:00 and we used to work together at pedestrian and he’s like, we got to bring you on. Like you do amazing cool things. I was like, yeah, yeah. Drunken talk, like didn’t think anything of it. Monday comes, he messages me going, hey, here’s the producers like details like contact her. I’m like, sounds good. 2 seconds later actually, what are you doing Friday? Like the producer said, there’s

a free slot. Actually, she’s going to call you like. Oh my. God, all happened. And I, look, I keep saying the guardian angels and my ancestors are like really watching over me, but my friends are like, give yourself some credit. And you know what? Yeah, I’ll fucking give myself credit. Yeah, take the credit. I worked for it. I’ve networked. I’ve created these relationships.

OK, so the process of this was way more simple than I thought it was going to be. OK? She just asked me to e-mail what the thing that I was going to make was. And because the Angus collab was happening, I was like, I’ll make the coconut sambar sandwich. Cool. So I was sent her the recipe. I had to write a fucking recipe also, man, I just swear.

I’ve just swore he please swear. OK, Thank you. Yeah. I’ve also been watching Gordon Ramsay’s documentary. He swears so much. And I’m like is. This the old 90s boiling point like the. Super No, it’s the new one. It’s like making of Bishopgate, which is his big empire. Anyway, tangent, believe that yeah, the, yeah, the producers

like eat, like send me the recipe. And thankfully for this collab, I had to write the recipe alongside Christos, who owns the cafe, and he was amazing at facilitating a space for me to learn how to write a recipe. So I had the recipe, I just had to tweak it a bit, send it through to she’s like, amazing. Sounds good. Didn’t really prep me for the TV at all because someone had told

her that I’ve done front facing work, like camera facing work, which I have and I I’m fine. But this is live television, guys. National live television. Anyways, that week was so busy because there’s few things like urban List articles going live. We were shooting for urban List video contents. I had no time to even sit and like freak out about it. Friday came went into set, and

the coolest part was growing up. I’ve watched a lot of Food Network and the thing that they always say I’m sure you guys know is they’ll, you know, on television, you can’t be preparing something for an hour. Swap. Yeah, they do the swap and they go. Here’s something I prepared earlier. It’s like something my whole life I wanted to say. And so to have the opportunity to go on live national

television and go, I literally asked to produce. I was like, am I allowed to say she was babe? Go for it. I was like sweet. The coolest part was also meeting Larry again growing up, watching him. So that was crazy. There was no preparation. I just remember they went for.

I had to do this crazy thing. So it was essentially before my segment. There was an ad break. Before the ad break, they do the next stop, guys coming on to show us La La, la. And that happens. And before they’re gonna break, they’re like, you know, do a big wave. And I was like, OK, cool. If people want they can go and find this. But I don’t know why instead of waving with one hand, I do this

whole thing and I’m gonna show you like man agent and like this, like, you know, this car dealership WAVY. The guys, Yeah, yeah. That’s literally, I don’t know why she just said wave and I just got so excited and then came back from the ad. Oh, while the ad break was happening, they’re like, OK, you’re gonna do this and this. That’s when they briefed me what to do.

Barely brief me, but yeah, no, it was actually a really awesome experience. I don’t know who the target audience, though. It’s definitely not my target audience. But you know, it’s still exciting. It’s cool. Big one, big one to tick off. And I kind of feel like I peaked too early in the. I don’t know what else to do. Yeah, true. It’s only like, what is it February now? Yeah, true.

Well, hey, maybe it bodes well for the rest of the year, so. It’s true. I think there’s good things going. Oh, that’s a beautiful story. Yeah, it’s so funny. I I love the idea of like, like people like, I love the idea of like people like sort of doing the, like the sort of the, I don’t know, just like the sort of media training thing and like get like doing the, you know,

you just go on the TV show and you do the right thing. I don’t know, I just, I like the idea of because I, you know, I grew up. Oh, no, I didn’t grow up, but in my 20s I was the kind of artist who I was like, I’m not marketing myself. I’m. Unmarketable. Oh my God, yes I will not. Advertise my products and I also will be sad if no one listens to the music but like or whatever like but you know and now I’m.

Met Were you in a band? Yeah, I’ve played in bands. Yeah, you’re. Giving band. I’ve got band vibes. Yeah. There’s like guitars everywhere, like. Like, not because of that. Yeah, yeah. And now I’m like, to my friends, I’m like, why don’t we make this a really sexy product? Yeah, I’ll photograph you. Like, we’ll make it great. And it’s gonna be so marketable.

Yeah, it’ll be immediately understandable just from the images. And everyone’s like, listen, bro, I’m still 26. Like, I’m probably not really ready for that. But yeah, now I’m like, like, let’s go, like, market me up. Yeah. And I can still have the fun art stuff in the back of my brain. Yeah, but. I also maybe get another gig or something because I’ve done all the media can still have

integrity yes, I think you’re so well placed to speak to this, right? Cuz you’re clearly, well, you got your marketing stuff and you seem to be really good at it and it’s really considered and I think in a way everyone’s like we’re OK with it when there’s no such thing as like a sell out anymore. Well, I think that’s the thing. You just need to get over that. And that sounds so much easy,

but I felt similar to you where like in my early 20s because I also had, I have a marketing background. So my first eight years of my life was marketing and I didn’t like how transactional that was. But I realized that was transactional because I’m working for businesses. Of course that’s transaction. But when you’re a self-employed person and you’re all like, even if it’s not employed, it’s just

a hobby that you want to share, that’s not marketing in a transactional way, that’s actually sharing knowledge and if anything, bringing people together. And I think I had to get over that as well. When I made tablet guys, there was this real icky feeling of like, oh, and even my personal Instagram now has become a bit very like, you know, marketing my brand well, pro as hell.

No, I don’t know. But sometimes I try and reel back. Like the other day I posted like fun things, like fun things I did with my friends and it was just like, oh, what am I doing? But at the same time, it’s like when to be successful and to have opportunities, you have to go and get it. That’s something that I wish people told me in my early 20s. No one told you that. Opportunities, people say, say yes to opportunities.

You’re like, OK. Which opportunities? In bed, sitting there, like, where’s the opportunity? I’m ready for my opportunity. Yes, I’m ready now, but it’s like no opportunities going and getting, you know, it’s connecting with people, talking to people, telling people what you’re excited and what your next projects are. Like the biggest advice I could give anyone really is, and no one asked, but we’re asking, OK, glad.

Is that like if there’s something that you’re thinking about creatively or not even creatively, I think everything’s a form of creation, but say it like you’re like, hey, I, I, you know, I want to open a wine bar or I want to photograph this artist or this person, say to multiple people, because you never know, that person might have a connection to the thing

that you want, right? And if you don’t, I, it’s kind of like, if you don’t put it out there, you’re not going to get it. But it’s that and also talking to people. You have to talk to people. About it, Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah. OK. So in just our last like little bit here, I would love to know where you’re eating in Sydney. Like where are some places that

you think we should know about? Oh my God. OK this is so nerve breaking. Wait, we. Need to ask you a question like a day. Ago, so yeah. Do you need? Some time to think. We’ll play the the thinking music. You’re gonna hate the answer I’m gonna give because it’s no longer exists. We’re we’re, we have a lot. Of love now no one can be.

Upset, no, I’ll give for you, but Kobe Thiam is a Malaysian restaurant that was in Ultima. It was like a family run business. It was beautiful, really authentic Malaysian food no longer exists. I’m so sorry. But I will give you other delicious spots that you can go to. Malacca Straight, also in Broadway. Delicious, beautiful Malaysian cuisine.

I mean, I’m in Miracle, so I should probably plug some of my favorite places. Ely Hill is a really lovely cafe run by this beautiful couple who are so sweet. And just for me, that’s what a cafe is. You go in there, you feel good, you feel relaxed. It’s never a rush to like get out. And the food is very simple. You’ve got AB and E, you’ve got

toasties, burgers, you’ve got little selections of cake and pastry. Love them guys, really. And, of course, could Angus? Oh my God. Of course Angus. Of course Angus. But. I’m definitely gonna. Go. What about this barn Mees? Because we’ve got a, we’ve got a ranking, which we won’t say.

Maybe we’ll wait until the end of the season. To say our I didn’t even want to say mine anymore. OK, but barn mees. To be honest, the best one I’ve had is in Melbourne. In boom in. In Richmond. In the background. No, I know. But in Sydney, to be honest, I mean in Miracle, I would say Miracle pork roll is good.

I know it gets a bit of like people like it’s not that good. It’s like, guys, it’s bloody, I mean. We just had some breakfast. Is it pretty fucking? We know we had Illawarra pork roll. Yeah, but it’s the same. It’s the same guys. Same guys, same. Guys, they just market it differently. Got it. Cool. And yeah, feel free to send through anymore shout. Out. No, definitely. Oh my God, I really wanted to. Give you sorry we really put you on this spot yeah yeah it’s

tough question we will we will get a list in the Instagram your. Favorite description? Hey, yeah. True. What’s your? Favorite sort of move wrap up. There was like a couple, couple more things, yeah, if you’re good for. Time. Yeah. Yeah, I’m good for time. One thing I’m interested in, I guess in, like, a lot of art, but especially food, is like this idea of challenging the

audience. Yeah. Which like can sometimes in other art forms be more allowed because there is a sense in food that like, it has to be yummy. And it has. To and you have to consume it, right? That’s the hard thing. Whereas like a painting, you can perceive it. Some like nails and some moldy bread. It’s a statement like no, you have to feed people dinner. Yeah, but I don’t know if that is.

Yeah. Wait, sorry, what’s your question? I guess it’s like is that it’s kind of like a version, like for example, it’s like there’s the menu, right? And it’s like, this is what the chef really wants to cook and no one orders it. And everyone just ordered like the Palmy or the butter chicken and you’re like, fuck, like, I don’t know if there’s that sense of like if there’s things on your menu. That you feel? Yeah, I’m like, well, this is

the thing. The trick also as like a small cook who’s taking up space is that you don’t overdo. So for example, the Angus collab, it’s one food item, 2 drinks, and you know, you’re there for that purpose. If I had like 6 things, of course there’s going to be things that aren’t doing well as others. And something that I learned in the past few years also is, and

this is I had to break the cycle as someone who’s come from a very ethnic family, is that it’s actually because in a lot of ethnic families, the more is best, right? Like, you know, my mum, if we’re having visitors, she would cook like a six different items, 6 to 12 sometimes, who knows? And I do that as one. I had to learn that actually pare it back. Like people can appreciate one

to two item. And in fact, there’s actually better appreciation one to two item where you can put all your energy and not burn out. So I would say like to answer that question. It really is everything I do moving forward is doing less. And like even with the Angus collab, what the beautiful, what has been the beautiful thing is that I’ve, you know, obviously done all the creative process,

marketing it prior to it, leading up to it. And you know, I’m hands on as much as I can, but now it’s up to the chefs. So it kind of feels like it’s the best way as to be sustainable as like a one person business. Yeah. Awesome. Wow, great answer. OK, well. You just don’t even give the sucker customers. Sorry customers, you’re always

wrong. Don’t. Even give him a choice. Well, I’ll take the feedback, right? Like I love feedback and if you want to say something doesn’t taste good, but you know, it’s, I think when there’s less items to choose from, I think there’s less feedback or less. It’s a great call. Yeah, it’s a huge menu is totally. Yeah, cool. Yeah, it’s been so lovely having

you on. Thank you so much for this interview. It’s been really great conversation. Do you? So I don’t know when this is coming out, but if if there’s any plugs that you have, we can either do them now or you can send them in and we’ll. It’s going to come out after March 1st, isn’t it? This. Yeah, I think March 4th would be the earliest we could.

Yeah. Like I thought we could maybe do one. We’re just going to admin mode. I can take this out. We’re doing 1 this week. Even like on Saturday or something. We haven’t really figured out our schedule. Oh. Yeah, Do you wanna release this on Saturday? Yeah, we could actually. OK, so we’re gonna release it on the 28th, so. A good time, yeah. So yeah.

It’s the Feb. I was like 28th to the first one, yeah. Yeah. But yeah, anyway, yeah. Yeah. No, nothing else in the works at the moment because I’m going to be overseas for a bit. But there are things that I’m brewing and people that I want to work with. And this year I’m keeping a lot of things really close to my heart and keeping a rid of a secret till the launch.

So great. I will let you guys know. Great. And I figured that out. And let people know how they can find you online, please. Yes, so table at guys on Instagram and that’s really it. Nothing else at this point, right? That’s all you. Really need help. Alright, well, thanks very much for coming in on this. Guys, I really. Appreciate it. Yeah, that was lovely to meet you.

And thank you for the chocolate. Cake. Oh good. Absolutely. I hope you finish it. Oh, yes, I will. If he doesn’t, I will. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I’m. Gonna fight Matt for that last, alright. Thanks. Guys. OK, bye everyone. Bye bye.

No, no.

Show notes

@hungup.au on instagram @tableatgayas on instagram  Gaya's post pod recommendations:  Malaysia small chilli - Campsie Willis canteen - Ultimo Kurumac - Marrickville Azuki Bakery - Enmore