4.10 Shot by A Childsoldierr

Transcript

Welcome back to Hung Up, Season 4, Episode 11. I’m Aiden. My name is Matt. Today we are talking to our friend, Tun. Also known as Childsoldier on Instagram. Fine art photographer, second year at VCA, also shoots fashion, occasional model, likes playing lol. League of Legends. Yeah, and what did we chat about? Fucking photos for an hour. Yeah, it’s something that Aiden and I have been thinking heaps about recently and then Tun’s name,

came up recently at dinner and we were like, we can get him. Yeah, let’s have him on the pod. And it was fucking really fun and educational. Yeah. And I think a good listen. Yeah. All right. Well, Marissa, run the tape. What’s up, man? Nothing much. I’ve been kicking back. Yeah. Living in Melbourne now. Yeah. Cool. I’m just studying full time. That’s, that’s really it. What about you guys? Yeah, I was saying I’ve been, I’ve been busy working on cool fucking fashion sets and assisting the

photographers and just kind of like chilling. It’s been really good. I’ve been kind of taking like days off to like work on my personal stuff. That’s good to hear. And what about you, Aiden? What have I been doing? I started taking photos, which was fun. I’ve like, I spent like ages, like most of my life, like never having taken a single photo, like not my phone, nothing. And then.

That’s pretty crazy. That’s pretty crazy. That’s fucking wild. He was like, he was like, I’m not going to do that. Like I don’t take photos. I’ve been into photography since I was literally a little kid. Yeah. And, um, one day he’s like, what did you, I don’t know how it came about. It took a couple goes. Like, so, uh, like in terms of like all the art that I like, photos were always like the trickiest for me. Yeah. Like, you know, you get some people like, I don’t understand painting. I don’t understand fucking experimental music. That was like me.

Yeah. Photos. I’d like be like, I love painting. I love all this shit. And then I’d see a photo in like a gallery and I’d be like, huh? Like what? Like, why is this? I just didn’t get it. Yeah. I think photography is a fine art is a pretty weird medium. Yeah. It’s like, it’s so out, it feels so out of place, but like, I think it’s getting to the point where it’s people kind of like understanding, which is really cool.

Yeah. Yeah, totally. It’s been really beautiful to like, it was like, you know, it only took me what, like a month with the camera in my hand, some old ass, like, what is it? Nikon D60 with stupid lens. Like he’s got like a 55 to 200. Oh, wow. Yeah. Which is funny. It’s like, everything’s like always too close. And it’s like, it’s a really tight frame.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It’s a really confusing way to learn to take photos, but it, yeah, it took about a month and then we would do like Matt and I and like friends would sit down and like, look at the photos and be like, you know, look at the composition and what were you trying to do here? And it only took like a month until suddenly like seeing photos opened up in this really profound way.

Yeah. Yeah, right. I’m obsessed with the fine art photos. So that was kind of the big artistic thing to me. Yeah. Yeah. I’m glad to hear that you guys are just even like self assessing and just kind of doing like critical sort of things. Like, I think that’s one best, like one of the best things that I’ve kind of been able to have while studying at an art school is just having that sort of like people coming around and sitting together and kind of assessing each other’s works.

I think that’s one of the best things that you can really get while you’re at uni. So it’s actually pretty cool to hear that you guys are even able to do that because a lot of people don’t, a lot of artists just kind of sit back and just kind of trust their own interests. Yeah. Yeah. I think it’s like, it’s been really like fun just to sort of do like, what is it? Like a monthly little like crit just ourselves. And, um, and like, it’s forcing me, even though like, you know, I’ve been doing it for a long time. It’s forcing me to really think about like what I like. And, and it’s funny. Cause I was like, do you want me to teach you like composition, how I was taught it? Or like, do you want me to teach you like what I like to do? You know what I mean?

Yeah. And just breaking, breaking the rules. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. And like, we’ve kind of been doing a bit of both and yeah, it’s been, it’s been really, really interesting. And like this dude has picked it up pretty quick. Like he’s already got some like banging photos, like after like a month of doing it. Yeah, that’s good. It’s a lot of fun.

Yeah. So yeah. Do you want to tell us about what you’re studying and like where at? Oh yeah. Um, so I’m studying a bachelor of fine arts at, um, VCA in Melbourne. Um, it’s my second year. Um, it’s been pretty quick finished next year, which is pretty, pretty nuts to think about. Um, yeah, that’s really it. Nothing too major, nothing too crazy. I’m just an everyday art school kid.

Like just a few months ago. Like, yeah, it doesn’t feel like you’ve been gone that long. Yeah, I know. It’s, it’s so weird to think about. Like I was actually talking about it with one of my friends the other day. I was just like, holy shit. Like I’ve lived in Melbourne for like almost two years. Like that just feels so weird because I’m just so like accustomed to like the whole like Sydney weather.

Yeah. Like the lifestyle in Sydney is, I just miss it so much. I actually love Sydney so much. It’s so controversial in Melbourne when I talk about it, like how much I love Sydney. Are you rocking the I love Sydney shirt or is that an I love? No, I’m not. I’m not. I’m wearing I love New York t-shirt. Um, if I could change it to I love Sydney, I would. I would.

So what made those, I think, I don’t know their actual name. It’s like Kings Cross Fountain. Did you see those, Matt? Yeah, I have seen people rocking those. I love Syd. Those are beautiful. Yeah, that’s one of those. Yeah, can you tell me a little bit? Because actually the first time and the last time I met you in person too, you had like a house show in Newtown, was it?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Um, how long ago was that? That was like a year ago, I think. Yeah, that was like, that was like a couple of days before I’d like moved as well. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. And you were kind of going like, I’m kind of ready to move to Melbourne. So yeah, it’s kind of cool to pick it up and just, yeah, like in general, how has it been? You’re like missing Sydney weather, but is like the art. Yeah. What’s the, what’s the art vibe?

Um, art is very, in Melbourne, yeah, it’s, it’s massive. Like, it’s kind of like almost an everyday thing. Um, like I have a fair few friends who run certain like offsite sort of like, in like uninstitutionalized galleries and whatnot. So going to those is like always fun because you’re always like amongst just your peers. Really?

Yeah. Yeah. And it’s like nice to be able to see like local work instead of like institutionalized stuff. And it’s like, I don’t know, it’s just nice to be able to have that sort of like connection to it compared to like going to like an NGV or like the White Rabbit and like NGA or whatever. Um, so yeah, it’s kind of nice to be able to see just local work that you see in like studios that you like, are like so like close to, especially when you’re studying with these people and whatnot. So yeah, it’s kind of nice. And it’s like, everyone’s always making art and whatnot.

Um, but yeah, it’s competitive, I’d say it’s like, it’s like a friendly competition in Melbourne. Yeah. It’s interesting. I don’t know. Yeah. Can you tell us more about that? Like, did you, did you have a sense of what you were looking for maybe when you left? Like, did you feel like maybe Sydney art scene was missing something? Um, I think when I, when I left Sydney, I think with the art scene, I don’t know much about it except for the fact that I know, I feel like Sydney is coming up on the rise of it.

Um, just because I’ve been, I’ve been seeing a lot of like similar stuff with, um, Sydney having like sort of like galleries in people’s houses, backyards, et cetera. Yeah. Um, and I’m glad to like see Sydney is doing that and like kind of following in that footstep. Um, just because like, yeah, I think that was like one thing where I was like, when I applied to like NAS and VCA, um, the one thing was just basically how many people I know, um, in Sydney compared to Melbourne, just because I think most of the people I knew were already moving to Melbourne and all lived in Melbourne.

And in Sydney, it was kind of like a, I knew like a handful of people, but I didn’t know too many people just because I wouldn’t, I wasn’t studying. Like I was like very new to the scene and like, kind of like moved from Canberra when I was like 19. Yeah. So yeah, I don’t know. Also like the only reason I didn’t really go to NAS was just because it was like a private institution and I don’t really have money to afford that.

So yeah. Yeah. So it was like, that was like really the toss up between the two, but no, I think, I think Melbourne kind of gave me the, um, the driving factor of moving there was just because of like, yeah, just like the, the scene and like how many people were doing it. And it’s just like, it’s so, there’s just like, it’s just always happening.

Like it’s so constant. There’s always like shows happening somewhere. Yeah, totally. Fuck yeah. Like a Thursday, Friday. Whereas like at the time when I was living in Sydney, it wasn’t like, I wasn’t, I wouldn’t hear about it as much just because yeah. I don’t know. I don’t think I was like too in touch with everything, but, um, I can see that Sydney’s kind of doing it sitting now, which is like really cool because I love the fact that Sydney’s kind of doing that.

And like, I’ve always said it, but like Sydney has this like untapped potential. Like I can see Sydney becoming like a very like, um, thriving art scene for like Australian artists and whatnot. Yeah. I feel the same way completely. Yeah. Um, so I wanted to talk about like your photography style and maybe like your, I don’t know.

I feel like there’s a bit of a philosophy like going on. Oh yeah. Well, like, yeah. I saw you the other night at like dinner and I was, I was kind of like, I was like standing. I was like, what I love about your attitude to at least like what I’m seeing online is like, you seem to like have, um, you’re not going to be a good idea.

I mean, I don’t know how many photos you take in the, you know, that we don’t see, but I really feel like you kind of like pick a photo and then like you really back it. Like I remember the photo, is that the one behind you? There’s like a ballerina. Oh no, the ballerina one has been sold off. Yeah. Um, this one, this one is like found sort of media work really.

Yeah. Like, um, yeah. One thing I actually like, yeah. One thing I actually even like kind of learned and all like, I guess expanded my art sort of like productivity or creativity through was generally like using found footage and also like, um, found material.

So like stuff at the back here, that’s, um, from a like shop front sign. Cool. Yeah. It’s like, I’ll go closer, but it’s like a, yeah. Yeah. Right. It’s like a Joe Malone thing. I don’t know.

I used it for, um, one of my show, like end of the, end of the semester sort of stuff last year. Yeah. But, um, yeah, no, the boundary one has been sold off, but yeah, a lot of the stuff I’ve been like doing specifically has been just like through found footage. Yeah. Yeah. Found media, um, just things that I guess are around us, but yeah, I do have a printed one that I’ve kept for myself.

Oh, hell yeah. Just that one. Damn, dude. Nice. Well, what I was going to say to him is like, it feels like you sort of like really, you pick photos of those and you like, you really back them. Like you sort of get behind it, which, which I love seeing that, you know, I’ve seen, I mean, we’ve all seen like tons of photographers who like are constantly producing, like, you know, just and posting stuff.

And like, that’s fine. There’s nothing wrong with that. But I just, I love how you’re like, you’re really selective. And then you’re like, this is the photo that like I’m saying right now. And it’s like, like, can you talk about it? Was that like an intentional thing or did that just. Yeah. Um, that’s kind of, that’s kind of me just being like very like picky. And, and like, almost like in a perfectionist sort of way, just because like, I do take a lot of photos and I don’t tend to show a lot of them on the internet.

But, um, most of the photos that I do show, like, as you said, yeah, I love backing them just because once I’ve kind of like felt a resonant, like a resonant sort of like feeling and understanding of this work or this image that I’ve kind of taken. And I kind of like, I don’t know, I kind of just like feel like this is something I need to fucking show off.

Like, this is, this is like something that needs to be like shown to people like they need to see it. Um, and yeah, I like one thing I learned while studying is that photography as a fine art is very like selective. Like photography in a fine art sort of medium is like, even though.

Oh, what’s this? What would I say? Usually I struggle with this thought, but it’s like with like painting and like sculpture and all these other mediums where you can create things from like your hands. Um, straight from like your mind, um, photography is a form where it’s like, you kind of envision these sort of things and like, I don’t know, like a scenario or like, um, something that you kind of want to portray.

And like through that way, you kind of have to take these images and like all these thousands of images that you take, um, only very few of them are going to be like selected. And it’s like that sort of, that’s like the sort of form and like the, um, understanding that I have with photography as a fine art. Like that’s, that’s how I’d have to show off what I can kind of create through my own sort of like image.

Um, so yeah, like that’s, that’s what, that’s why I’m like very picky and like kind of like back certain images just because it’s like if painters can like kind of imagine these sort of scenarios, ideas and images and then paint them onto a canvas. Like I should be able to kind of do that, but like selecting that through all these thousands of images I’ve made, um, or I’ve taken and whatnot.

So yeah, it’s kind of like, that’s my sort of thinking with most of the photography work that I’ve kind of like made as of recent. I guess it’s kind of like poetically just too, because it’s like, you know, we’re able as photographers to take like, yeah, 10,000 photos in the time that it would take someone to paint like one candle, you know?

So it’s, it does seem sort of fair in that way. Agreed. Yeah. A hundred percent. No, I a hundred percent agree. It’s pretty, it’s pretty crazy for photographers as well, just because yeah, there’s also like, there’s so many images on the internet in the world. So it’s hard to like be able to even like distinctively like make something yours.

Yeah. Yeah. It’s funny how like, I don’t know what, I mean, I’ve probably only taken what a thousand photos maybe. And I’m sure you guys have taken a hundred thousand or more. Um, but it’s funny how like there is this, cause I, I mean, I’ve spent a long time like writing. It’s been a while, but you know, a good 10 years writing and that sense of attachment you have to something that you have written or something that like,

even to someone like a friend of yours or like one of your images, Matt, during that like little crit session we were doing, um, we like looked at a bunch of photos we’d taken on film and we, then we like looked at some William Eggleston stuff afterwards. And we were like, okay, we need to like cleanse out our eyes of our like shitty images like that we love.

I’m like, oh, Matt took that and I love it. Or that is a photo of Matt and I love it. But I’m like, you know, there’s this separation, but it’s so cool because it’s like, you know, in those sessions, sometimes we’ll start talking like, oh, these are just snaps, these ones. So it’s like the same media or the same, like the same, it’s the same camera and the same session.

But because of the nature of like, you know, sometimes it’s a fine art photo or it’s like, we were trying to grasp at some greater meaning. And sometimes it’s just, this is a snap. So yeah, it’s just, it’s lovely how this whole thing is unfolding. Yeah, it’s true. It’s got like a sort of spectrum that, that photos can land on. Like, I mean, you know, we, we all probably would agree that like anything that comes

out of the SD card or out of the like role of film is like, could be a candidate to be in a gallery, you know? Yeah. But, um, and when we press the shutter button, we’re, we’re just thinking like, I just want to capture this moment socially, you know, like it’s Aiden wearing a funny hat, like in a shop, you know, or whatever.

Yeah. Is there any on your Instagram or just in general that you would like, we could talk about for a moment? Like, yeah, I mean, you guys can go ahead and choose. Um, I did like, I have a fair few that I posted recently, um, that are kind of, that I’m building towards a bigger show and or a book.

Um, but yeah, I don’t know. It’s so hard to like share images on the internet sometimes. Cause I’m just like, I’m always thinking about like, Oh, like I like this, but what do the people that follow me for my work at least like, like, I don’t know. It’s kind of hard to have that sort of relationship, especially in like a fine art sort of aspect as well. Cause sometimes you have to think about yourself rather than kind of anyone that’s around

you. But, um, yeah, I don’t know. A lot of my work recently has been just color. Um, yeah. I don’t know. I’ve been like very distant with, um, a lot of the analog stuff that you guys would have seen earlier. Yeah. Just because it’s so expensive these days. It’s kind of like so fucked. I know. It’s crazy. Yeah. It was really funny to think, like you’ve said before, like there’s so many images.

What is that? Billions of images. Yeah. And then I was like, Oh, each of these, like I got a little point and shoot Minolta. And I was like, what’s this like a dollar 50, $2 a photo. Yeah. And it was, it was kind of really sweet though, to have that value on like a single image to be like, Oh yeah. Lost me two bucks. Yeah. It was kind of beautiful, but I can imagine if you’re trying to, you know, really crank

out something or get a certain. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And I have four. That’s like my food money for the week. Yeah. No. Perfectly fine. I’ve a iPhone sitting right there.

But yeah, that’s, I had this, I had that exact, um, conversation with my tutor. Cause he was like, um, when he was studying where I’m at, like at VCA, he was like, Oh, it’s either, you know, I buy, I know a $20 roll of like Portra 100 and, or I don’t eat dinner. Like it was either one of those two.

And I was just like, yeah, honestly, that makes a lot of sense. I kind of understand that. But yeah, that’s why digital has been so handy and it’s been just so much more fun recently, but it’s definitely kind of impacted my sort of like ability to kind of like create something without having to see it. So the thing, especially when you’re shooting on analog, what’s the, what’s the difference

to you? Like as far as how you work? Oh, um, yeah. So like, just like as of recently with digitally, it’s been, it’s just too easy to take photos like all the time. Like you never run out of space to be able to take images unless, you know, the SD card

is fucking full, but like, yeah, with digital, it’s like, you’re constantly taking photos and there’s just like this abundance of images, which is a good thing, especially if I’m like being very selective with it. But, um, through that, it’s kind of like, I would say personally, it’s affected me in a way where it’s like, when I just personally used to shoot analog, I would just like be very

like tame with how I shot things, especially just because it’s like 32 shots on a roll. So it’s like taking shots on analog, I’m very like much more selective and kind of careful, especially when I’m looking through a viewfinder compared to like my digital camera, like my Rico, which is like this like little like handy pocket cam.

GR, love those. Yeah. They’re nice hair. Yeah. Sick. Very nice. It saved my life. Um, but yeah, it’s just like, yeah, just always taking photos on that. It’s just so much more easier to kind of like lose yourself and you kind of just like end up just taking all these like photos and they can all be like shit. Yes. But I mean, like it doesn’t really matter at the end of the day because you’re not paying

for anything except for the camera. Um, but yeah, through analog, it’s just like so much, I don’t know. I feel like you’re just very like technical and you kind of like think about things. Like you sit there and like, you feel like this mental sort of like boom, as if you’re like a mathematician solving an equation or something. Um, but yeah, I know digital is kind of definitely made me lose that sort of, um, yeah, ability,

but I do want to get back to analog at some point and kind of just, what is it perfect? That sort of craft and whatnot. I pray that you do. I love your analog stuff. I mean, I like your digital stuff too. This collection, uh, called shivering that you’re kind of teasing on, um, Instagram. Do you want to talk about this a bit?

Was that shot on this like little Rico? Like, yeah. Like portrait, um, on like, what is it? The third or fourth slide on that Instagram post. Oh yeah. Okay. You know what? How do I pull this up? I need to, I need to remember how I even posted this. Yeah. Um, which one was it? The third or fourth post.

It’s like, like crouching down and this like pool of light, like coming through. Oh yeah. Yeah. That one was kind of crazy. Um, yeah, that was taken on the Rico as well. Um, that was just like on the train. Oh wow. Um, yeah, I was kind of just, yeah, I’m just on the train on my way to uni and it was like

probably one of the sunniest days in Melbourne at the, like in the last like couple of weeks. Yeah. And this guy was just kind of like listening to, which I think is like a tape recorder maybe. Oh. Or some sort. Um, it’s like this, like a little red box and he kind of was just crouching down and he kind of just like, it looked very like angelic.

Yeah. Yeah. Kind of just like very, yeah. Yeah. He just seemed very like, I don’t know. He felt like, I felt like when I was looking at him, he felt like he was at peace for some reason. Yeah. Like I was kind of just like, wow. Like I kind of admire the fact that this guy is kind of just like doing his thing. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. That’s such a cool like reading.

Cause yeah. At the same time as like, there is that like serenity and calm and peace and the light is angelic and the tape recorder is like such a strange object to have now. But then there also feels like there’s this like potential tenseness, especially like also when you reveal it’s like on the train, it’s like, it’s not usually a site for like, like, you know, meditation or prayer.

It’s like, if you’re kind of, uh, I don’t know, crouching down on a train, my first thought is like, are you okay? Like what’s going on? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, like you get so, I don’t know, there’s so many readings to it. It’s like, it’s so insane. Cause like, I, yeah, the image, like I also liked the blue, like one of the big things I’ve kind of been fucking with recently is just colors.

Like I really love, that’s one thing I love about colors specifically is yeah. Colors. Like everyone, like most people being able to kind of like see and understand, um, these things and like how colors kind of impact people and like your sort of like emotional reading. I don’t know. Like blue is a very like big sort of, um, uh, what’s that word?

Um, I guess inspiration. I don’t know. Blue is just like very like prominent in my life currently. It’s like a totem, I would say like for you, like just looking at your recent stuff, it’s like, it’s like totemic. It’s like sort of representative of something like even across like different collections and different images and thoughts.

Like this blue keeps coming back. There’s kind of like deep, like indigo, like kind of blue. Yeah. I mean, it’s just that whole like blue and like purple chart. I know it feels so like, yeah, it’s very like, it kind of touches my soul sort of thing. I don’t know.

I just resonate with it so much. It’s just so like, I feel like the color, I don’t know. For me personally, the blue, blue is just like very, just like, yeah, it’s saying certain things. It’s like, it can be like very jolly, happy, fucking sad. But it’s just like, yeah, I don’t know. I think just like mixing with color and being, especially in that image itself, the blue is so like strong just because the ground is blue.

Like the train, the train ground is literally blue. So it’s like, it’s kind of like overlapping and kind of taking over this sort of thing. It feels like it’s just like kind of golfing this guy almost in a sense. But another thing that’s really cool to me about this photo is the like kind of radical highlights and shadows. Like, you know, like cameras kind of want to make everything gray if you have them on auto.

And like everyone’s, everyone’s like sort of like in air quotes, correctly exposed images have like don’t have that much info in like the brightest part and the darkest part of the image. But this one, like the pool of light is going all the way to white, but also like the guy’s pants are like as black as the photo can be.

Can’t actually get any blacker. And yeah, just like the dynamic range on this photo is so cool. And like still like, you know, his hand grasping, like what is it, his backpack or something. It’s still so, it’s like correctly exposed, you could say. Yeah, really beautiful. Beautiful. Thank you.

Really beautiful. Yeah, I think, yeah, another thing that’s very prominent in my work is like, yeah, as you’re saying, like the gray scale, basically, like just like white and black. And yeah, like how cameras and especially when you’re shooting on like black and white film, you’ll tend to see that most of your photos after developing and if you scan them just come out like very gray, like they try and push in the gray.

Yeah. Which I kind of, I don’t know, kind of really dislike just because it’s like, if you’re like shooting in a certain way, you’d want to be able to see like the whites and the blacks and whatnot. And thank God with technology this day and age that we’re able to kind of just do that by hand without having to like, you know, go into a dark room and then like print that out and then having to like explain that and show that.

But yeah, you’ll see that in a lot of my work in general, even in the black and white stuff, like the hand printed stuff that I’ve made. I always tend to try and push out gray and always try and kind of light and end or deepen certain areas. Yeah. Yeah. We’re just looking through it back through the like Instagram stuff.

Like, yeah, totally. I mean, I love this like high contrast stuff. It looks, it looks insane. Like, it’s so cool. So have you been doing like some, you’ve been like doing some modeling work and stuff, right? And like. Yeah. Being models as well. Yeah. Yeah. So, yeah. Um, I, I started modeling earlier this year.

Yeah. I’d say. Yeah. Earlier this year. Um, with some Sydney agent agency. Um, and like I’d shoot, I’ve shot for them before. Yeah. And then they kind of like messaged me and then kind of just like, was like, yeah, we’re kind of interested in your look anyways. So I kind of signed with them, but that kind of helped me open a gateway into like shooting other models that are on my like sort of agency as well.

Um, I haven’t done it as much recently just because I’ve been like really focused on my sort of like professional practice right now. Yeah. But yeah, I’ve just been shooting a lot of models and like a lot of the things I enjoy doing with models is fashion photography stuff and kind of like editorials and kind of creating scenarios. I know stories or whatnot.

Um, and I enjoy like seeing that sort of stuff on the internet as well. Like it’s really beautiful to be able to see like photography come to a sort of like beautiful standard, even in like fine arts. Like I think shout out to Dylan, one of my friends from uni. We both have been doing a lot, like a lot of like sort of incorporating a lot of our like fashion photography work into, um, our fine arts practice.

Yeah. Which is kind of fun just because it’s not very, I guess, I guess traditional or normal. Um, totally. So yeah, it’s kind of, it’s been nice to be able to do that and then have our tutors and like lecturers kind of look at us and be like, oh, these guys are like doing something like along the lines of editorials and fashion photography work into like this final practice. Interesting.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

Drop the Instagram handle. Um, video dot loss. Video dot loss. I’m sure people know. I’m sure people know as well. I work at very similar, which is kind of like fun to do. Yeah. That’s cool. Yeah. Can we hear some more about that? Like specifically, like did, did your tutor ask that question? And did you, I’d love to know like what your answers were like, you know, moving between those two.

Cause Matt, you’re kind of touching on that world right now. My partner’s kind of does production and stuff for fashion and is a photographer. So I’ve been kind of watching this new fashion photography world unfold. Yeah. And I’m like, I, I some, like, I’m not sure what to think yet. Like I’m still kind of holding onto some kind of like old fashioned ideas.

I think where I’m like, you know, I see a photo, like the one we were just looking at of yours. And I’m like, damn, like, it’s got that like punctum. It’s got that moment of excitement. I’m like, this is art, baby. Like, let’s go. And then I like, can’t divorce myself sometimes from seeing fashion stuff and being like, this is like an ad. Fuck you. Like, fuck off.

You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Gated and tricky than that. So I think it’d be really cool to. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No. So, um, I like recently last semester I did some work. It’s basically based around, um, models specifically. Like I have it as my, um, I don’t have, I haven’t posted it like on the grid, but it is on my story highlights and it’s called breathe.

Um, so most of it is kind of derived from like adverts specifically. I’m pretty bad with explaining this just cause it kind of like, it works up in here, but it doesn’t work out here. Um, but yeah, it’s just like, yeah. Based on like a lot of like, sort of like fashion models, adverts and like kind of like beauty and sort of in that sort of sense.

Um, so a lot of the images that I have taken from that series or that body of work was based around advertisement of like salons, um, like fashion adverts. Like there’s, um, some like stuff that I did with American apparel that I kind of like refigured into like a picture frame.

Um, and then, yeah, there’s like those images of those like women kind of like either from, um, getting plastic surgery, which is like from a TV show. What was it called? Botched from a botched episode, which I kind of, I didn’t take that photo, but I did like kind of, you know, edit it and reconfigure it into my own sort of way.

Um, and then, yeah, just like refig, like retaking photos of other photos. As you can see, like there’s like four images, like four models altogether huddled together sort of like in a hairstylist sort of way, like from a salon. And then, yeah, but yeah, most of these, most of the images and the works I did from that were, yeah, just based on like adverts and kind of just, um, fashion and beauty.

Yeah. Um, and I kind of got that sense and idea just from just like, just because like growing up in a time of where the internet was like so heavily influenced from like American media. Yeah. Like that’s how I kind of basically explained it to my tutor. They were just like, okay, that’s pretty cool and interesting just because like you’re kind of taking this idea from, um, I don’t know, the stuff that you’d see like fashion wise and then kind of incorporating that into your own sort of fine art practice and kind of explaining that in your own sort of way.

But yeah, I don’t know. That’s like basically how I can explain it. Um, it’s just like, yeah, I really find it interesting to be able to kind of like express a sort of like understanding feeling and like upbringing of, um, someone’s, I don’t know, past or whatever. And kind of explaining that through, I don’t know, their sort of interests.

And my interest at that point was specifically through fashion and advertisements and like beautiful people and whatever else. Yeah.

Interesting. Um, so do you have like a kind of like, you know, like a direction that you want to head in with like, do you, do you want to be a fashion photographer? Do you want to be an art photographer? Like bit of both maybe? Yeah. I mean like basically a bit of both. Um, it’s kind of, I don’t know.

I’m kind of in that boat where I’m just kind of trying to understand where I’m at, um, with art specifically. Um, I am like kind of a bit confused and lost, but, um, I do want to like obviously continue taking photos and at least somehow make a comfortable living off it so I can actually continue doing it.

Yeah. Um, but yeah, I think fashion is something that I would like to kind of like put myself into just because I find it so fun to be able to take photos of just people. Yeah. All the time. Yeah. And I love taking photos of people in like clothes and just like kind of just in a candid or nonchalant sort of way. It’s kind of just fun.

Um, and with like fine art. Yeah. I think that’s just basically just something that’s going to continue to happen as much as long as I kind of like, I guess, enjoy taking photos really. Yeah. Um, yeah. Yeah. But yeah, I don’t know. I think the, the end goal is definitely to just be able to kind of put my work somewhere where it’s recognize and kind of inspire younger, I don’t know, Southeast Asian kids.

Yeah. Just because I, I didn’t have that growing up. Yeah. So like I would love to be able to be that sort of like pillar and or something that kind of like helps people kind of like strive to do something. Yeah. Within that sort of field. Yeah. Sick. Yeah. That’s, that’s a beautiful like, um, inspiration and like direction. I love that. Cool.

So, um, like, can we talk about like some more like technical stuff, like just fashion stuff? Do you, do you, are you interested in like, I mean, like, I don’t know what it’s like down there. I mean, I know there’s like a bit of a fashion, like photography sort of circle, but like on set in Sydney, I’m seeing a lot of like, uh, situations where there’s like 20 people on set and there’s like two or three people.

Like usually I’m the second assistant or first assistant, like to the photographer. Yeah. Like flashes and reflectors. And like, are you shooting in that kind of world? Like, are you interested in the lighting side of things as well? Yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent. Um, so usually like on set stuff. Um, I don’t actually, we don’t, I don’t actually have that many people.

Um, it’s usually just like, I kind of, I have friends who kind of are in that sort of world already who kind of like do makeup, hair and like styling or whatever. So I reach out to them and then kind of have them kind of like help me and assist me in these, um, shoots. So most of the time it’s usually only like ever five people.

Yeah. So it’ll be like me, the model, the stylist, hair and makeup. And then like my housemate Cameron, um, who always helps me with most of my shoots, like fashion shoots at least. Um, and he does like most of the like lighting and like he holds the reflectors and whatnot. And we try to get that done.

But yeah, most of the time it’s just like very, a small amount of people. It’s not very like professional. Um, I think like the, the idea of a small set is really appealing to me because when they get bigger and bigger people, it becomes less of a social thing and people can get disconnected from like, if there’s a mission, you know, it just can tend to just all, we’re all like, we’re just in the hair crew and we don’t talk to the, it’s like, yeah.

Sucks. I think. Yeah. No, I recently actually like had that sort of feeling and understanding when I was like, um, I was modeling for this photographer. Um, and it was like a pretty massive set. Like it was like, they had hired out this house out in like Woodend, which is like really far out North in Victoria.

Um, and the Airbnb was like called like Hollywood. It was just like, it’s like a massive house. Um, that looked like it was, it could be in Hollywood, but like, it was just like, yeah, this massive house with like this inbuilt library in this house. And then like pool tables and whatnot. But like the set was massive. There was like, I think at like one point, probably like 40 people.

Yeah. All like huddled into this house. Yeah. Um, and yeah, I definitely felt that weird, like sort of like, um, disconnected. It was like very businessy, which is like cool. And I kind of like that. I like to be able to see that like, um, photography can kind of like go into that sort of realm. Yeah. But it was, yeah, it was pretty odd to see that from like a, I guess more of like a model aspect than like someone who was taking the photos.

Cause I’m just like standing there being like, holy shit. Like what the fuck is happening? Yeah. I know. Yeah. Yeah. I often see these models, like just standing in this, the middle of this like crowd of people. And I’m like, damn, like what is, what is the going through their head right now? Yeah. Can we ask, like, that’s something that we keep kind of coming to that question. I think the role of the model is like deeply misunderstood.

And like in, even in mainstream culture, like everyone’s kind of having digs in it. Yeah. But like when do you get to talk to someone, the fine artist, the photographer and the model? Yeah. True. Truly every side.

Multidisciplinary. Um, yeah, I don’t know. Like, honestly, like I’m not like crazy on modeling. Um, so I, I kind of like, when I was on that set, I kind of just sat there. Like I was standing there just being like, okay, what’s my job? Like, I guess my job is to kind of like stand there, get my like face, I don’t know, done,

get my hair done and then look pretty. Yeah. Um, it was like literally like nothing going through my head except for like, oh, like, what am I going to look like? Like, how do I pose? Um, I don’t want to look like a, like a weird person for this photographer. Like, obviously like, you know, especially if it’s for like an, an important shoot, you want to like look the best as you can.

Um, but yeah, I think as a model, like it’s kind of, yeah, you kind of just stand there and get told what to do. So you kind of just like, you’re just like, okay, um, do you want me to like kind of look this certain way? Do you want me to pose a certain way? Oh, how do you want me to stand? Um, but yeah, I don’t know. You don’t really have to do that much. You kind of, other than just like standing around and obviously like making sure you’re

paying attention to what the, like the production team is saying. Um, you kind of just stand there. Like there’s nothing really that crazy and like, it’s kind of fun to be able to kind of just do that. But like at the same time, yeah, I don’t know. It’s a bit confusing. Like totally. Yeah. You’re also, you have to be okay. And this may be like more or less, and to some people would be horrible is to be like

object of the lens and 40 people and kind of be the center of, you know, like that could be considered quite a lot of work. So I, yeah, no, exactly. No, I agree. But yeah, I don’t know. Sometimes I’m just like, I mean, it was like, it was a long day. That’s all I’ve got to say. Like that, like that shoot was a long day. It was like from like 12 to like 2am.

So I was pretty tired by the end of it, but we did get pretty like fed pretty well. So I’m pretty happy with it. Um, but yeah, no, other than that, yeah, you definitely have to endure like a lot of like socializing, talking and like kind of like having to be in this atmosphere where it’s always something is happening. And so like, yeah, at points you do kind of just have to be like, holy fuck, like it’s

just like way too much. Um, and like, especially with me, I don’t talk to a lot of people often. Yeah. I’m pretty bad, like with like social gatherings and whatnot. And I’m kind of just like very like secluded. But, um, in that sort of setting, it was pretty, pretty nice to kind of just open my sort of like break my bubble sort of thing. Do you find like on set in that situation, you’re like art brain, like creeping in and

like, like how would I take this photo and stuff like that? Um, yeah, actually I have that, I have, I have that issue. Um, whenever I do like shoots or test shoots, I always end up just being like, oh fuck, like I would have taken it like this or like, this is how I would have done it.

Or like, I wanted, I wanted to look like this, but obviously because I’m the model, I don’t have that say. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. Um, but like, yeah, sometimes like, like whenever I’m like asked, oh, like there’s a test shoot with this photographer, um, would you like to do it? And then they send me their, I don’t know, their work or something.

I’m always like, I’m always thinking about it way too much. I always like kind of just get down to my head, just breaking it down way too much. It’s like, oh, like this stuff isn’t like how I kind of like really like these photos being taken, whatever, yada, yada. This is really what I would want like my, I don’t know, portfolio to look like. Oh, but, um, yeah, I definitely kind of have that sort of issue with, um, kind of like other

photographers when I have to kind of stand there and be photographed rather than photograph. Yeah. A hundred percent. Which is kind of, I feel like toxic. That’s kind of a bad thing though. Like I probably should just be like, fuck it. Like that’s, that’s their thing. Like let them do their thing. I guess that’s a more chill way of being. Like I’m very much like that. Like I don’t, you know, it’s unprofessional to like, if you’re on the crew to be like,

no, I don’t take the photo like that. But you do think like, obviously you’re like, you know, I would have taken it like this or whatever. Like I wouldn’t have put the subject like there in the frame or whatever. Yeah. Yeah. It’s pretty, it feels pretty normal to me. I think like maybe just cause we’re all kind of artists here, but like to have your own thoughts about the process. I mean, one thing that I’ve noticed, like, which is really funny about the commercial

stuff is like, and like, like just fashion and commercial photography in general is like, there is a bit of theater. Like the photographer can usually just be like, this photo was amazing. And like, just trust me, you know, if they can say it like really confidently or just like give that vibe off, then the client’s usually like, oh, awesome.

Like, you know, it’s very rare that I’ve seen a client that like, is like, no, I need it to look exactly like this. And they really know what they’re talking about and they don’t need that like guidance. You could call it from the photographer. And then on the other, on the other spectrum, at the other end of the spectrum, I’ve seen like photographers who just like actually suck, just like playing everyone being like, yeah,

dude, this is the best work I’ve ever done. And I’m like, kind of just like joshing and kind of like trying to convince everyone to sort of like, yeah. I shot with this guy. Do you know?

I’m going to beep all this out. And okay. Yeah. Um, I I’ve heard the name, but yeah. I was just like, shit. And it was like, dog, like, what are you doing here? I was like teaching Aiden, like basic composition stuff. Like just like, like normal stuff, like make it look kind of interesting. And then like, uh, that was at the same time as I was, I had this job.

It was a big three day job. And then the client would come over and look over our shoulder at the laptop and be like, bro, like, why did you put his head right in the middle of the frame? And like, like, can we crop some of that sky out? Like, it’s just all sky. Where’s the, where’s the product? Like where are the fucking, where’s the shoot? And I was just like, damn man, like this guy’s, and he was so confident and chill.

And everyone was just like, Oh, cool. Like, great. Love your work. He’s also got that institutional sort of backing. So it’s, you know, certified and verified. Yeah. I mean, that’s part of like everything, right? Like if you can sell yourself really fucking well. Yeah. In anything, pretty much like. 100%. Yeah. How much of that can like, you know, your skill can be that much less or your product

can even be that much less if people like believe it, which is a good and a bad thing, I guess. No, I agree. I think, I think that’s, that’s like something that I personally lack and I’m just so bad with selling myself. Yeah. Like, I don’t know how to fucking kind of hype myself up. So I kind of hope my work kind of does the, does that for itself.

But yeah, I think, yeah, I agree. Selling yourself is very necessary, especially in like an art scene. If you want to make sure that you’re able to kind of like sell yourself and make sure people are interested in your work and whatnot. Are you getting much of that at art school? Like at PCA? Are you getting, cause I’ve seen like people take like professional practice courses and

I’m sure, or I imagine all unions would have it now. Like there’s a good chunk of that. And like, if there is, is it useful?

They, they, oh yeah. I mean like they try and like teach us to kind of be able to be confident and be able to kind of speak about our work and all the stuff we do pretty well.

I think most people kind of already understand that to a degree, especially if they’re already confident to be able to just even do that off the bat. But I don’t see it as much at uni just because I feel like a lot of the time when people at uni, a lot of them are kind of just, just doing their thing.

Like they’re kind of just working. There is like a handful of people that definitely continue to kind of just like always showcase their work and kind of like, that’s how they sell themselves by like always putting on like gallery shows and whatnot. That’s the only way I’ve kind of been able to see it at a forefront.

But otherwise, yeah, no, everyone’s pretty chill with it. Usually a lot of it, a lot of the time is just, just through like gallery shows and whatnot. Like people just kind of sell themselves in that sort of way rather than just kind of like, sorry, say that again. Instagram, of course. And like, yeah. And like anyone at uni, like knowing better than like you guys already how to use Instagram

to like. Yeah. Yeah. Instagram is, it’s, it’s crazy how Instagram is so like necessary in this day and age to kind of like, yeah. Have you sell your work. Can we talk about like, I mean, your handle is pretty, can you tell us? Yeah. I have that tattooed actually.

Hold on. I’m going to take my shoes off so I don’t stand on my bed.

Let’s see.

Damn. Beautiful.

Yeah. People, people, people kind of get freaked out by the name sometimes. I don’t know. They’re just like, oh, it’s kind of insensitive. Like, I guess it kind of is if someone doesn’t have that sort of background and whatnot, but no. My dad, my dad was a child soldier. Like he, he like grew up in like the jungles of Burma, like south of Burma, like in the

Mon State area. So that’s where my family’s from. And my grandfather was like a nationalist politician of this like rebellious group, which my family like die and live for, which is really cool. But yeah, my, my dad kind of like dropped out of like seventh grade and joined the army.

Um, and yeah, I don’t know. He told me that story. Like my family would tell me that story and I was like, oh yeah, it’s like really cool. Like, it’s kind of like brave and like amazing. That’s how we got to Australia. That’s how my family migrated here. Um, and yeah. So like, I was thinking of like a name for myself to be able to like, kind of just like

have a handle and like sell my work as like something, you know, like rather than just traditionally having my full name, like Tanthanu, I’d rather like kind of have like a, I guess a persona almost. Um, but yeah, I kind of came up with child soldiers because yeah, it’s kind of like a homage to like my dad just because I like, kind of love that background. And like the whole thing about like taking photos, shooting and like my logo that I’d

made like recently was just based around like, you’ve been shot by a child soldier and it’s kind of just like a funny play on thing. So yeah. And that kind of was inspired like from like CSGO, like when people die and you, it’s like, oh, you’ve been killed by blah, blah, blah. But, um, but yeah, um, that’s kind of like really it. Like, yeah, my grand, my grandparents and my, my dad were just like all a part of this

like sort of like nationalist military that like rebelled against the military that like currently ruling over in Burma now. But yeah, I don’t know. That’s kind of like my whole thing. Like I was just a child soldier. Um, and also just because yeah, always working and kind of like, kind of trying to like, kind of like come back and relate to my own sort of background, like my own family and whatnot.

Yeah. How cool to be able to like, you know, like represent your history like that and like, just kind of have it as like this sort of standing like theme, like throughout your work. Like, I really like that. And then also just like the idea of a username in this like fine art context is so fitting. And so like today, it’s like the idea of like a painter, like, um, you know, how like

Picasso is like putting his name in the bottom, right? Like that seems so ridiculous, but like, like today, but a, um, like a username, like it’s, it just makes complete sense. Like it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s perfect. Yeah, no, I agree. I think it’s, it’s nice to have that professional sort of look with your full name, your government name, but also like being able to have that sort of like touch where it’s like, that’s

your username. And it’s like, oh, that’s shot by, that’s shot by Matthias or something like that. And it’s just like, oh yeah, I just love that idea. Just being like able to see that and be like, oh, it’s a child soldier. Oh, so sick. But yeah, I think it’s very necessary in this day and age at least, especially if you’re signing stuff off on the internet. Yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah.

Everyone has some sort of persona on the internet these days. So why not? How would you describe your internet persona? Um, I don’t know what, um, I feel like, what, what am I like on the internet? Um, I did this like video recently. It’s like, um, night vision.

Just looking. Yeah. One of, um, it was like, yeah, that’s actually a part of, um, the work that I’m working on now. I posted it and I looked at it and I was like, oh, but this looks like a thirst trap. Like, I feel like this is just way too, like, just over-sexualized. Like, I feel like I’m just like staring at the camera, smoking a cigarette, trying to look handsome.

Um, no, yeah, that, that video. Um, that video with actual sound, like proper sound, like it’s a two minute video of just me like self-documenting myself, just smoking a cigarette. Yeah. But, um, it has all these like gross sounds of me like spitting and like kind of like phlegm because like I didn’t actually have cigarette papers.

So it kind of was like fucked up and disgusting. But, um, yeah, I don’t know. I’d say my internet presence. Um, I don’t know. I guess I’m kind of like kick back. I don’t know. What would you say? Like, no, I’m kind of getting like a little bit of like mystery, you know, it’s like, who is this person? Like, it’s a little bit like, I think it’s cool.

It’s like, it’s got this like mystery, like all of the, the cross between the like social, like it’s a selfie. And then like, you know, like serious art photos is cool. It’s like, who the fuck is this? Like very mysterious. I, you know, I know people who follow you who are like, who is that person?

Yeah. True. Okay. That’s cool. I like that. I’ll take that. Yeah. Career perfect. You’re bang. Yeah. I’ll take that. I’ll take that for sure. I like that. I like that. That’s the right idea. Sort of like on a Banksy sort of level. Like, yeah, I’ll take that.

But no, like photographers, like local people or like, like any Instagram handles that we should know about or like any fashion photographers from Melbourne or Sydney that digging photographers right now locally. Yeah. I really like, um, definitely Dylan. Yeah. Dylan video loss. That’s, that’s my homie.

Yeah. We’re at work are very similar. So we had this like group show like, um, at VCA usually have, um, like a cohort sort of show a second. So we had a second year photography show. And, um, one of the funny things was like, um, some of the people who were like trying to curate, like we had like a bunch of people like curating on that.

Yeah. They’re like, Oh, we should put ton and like Dylan together. We were just like, no, like, please like separate our works. Like we don’t want this like full wall of just like all these images that kind of look already similar and like it’s aesthetic and colors and whatnot. So yeah, Dylan, Dylan, shout out video loss. He’s like a very talented photographer.

He’s also like, we just like kind of push each other and like inspire each other to kind of make work all the time. Um, and then other photographers, who else? Um, another local, but from Canberra, fucking Tim Hardy. He lives in Melbourne, but Tim Hardy is really cool. Um, I’ve known Tim from like year 11, year 12 days.

Yeah. Um, amazing photographer. He’s massive. He just did a, um, I think almost a collab show with Spencer Lai at, um, Neon Park in Melbourne. Some really cool work. Um, yeah. Fucking Tim Hardy is an amazing photographer. Yeah. And shout out to all the people who know Arnett. Arnett is an OG from like Canberra who kind of got me into photography.

But he’s, he’s some dude who kind of just like went off the grid, but he’s amazing. He kind of paved the way for like a lot of like, I’d say artists in Canberra around my age at least. Oh yeah. What do you mean he went off the grid? He just like stopped posting. He just full disappeared. Wow. Yeah. Um, no, I’m like, I’ve, I’m in contact with him now, but yeah, he kind of just stopped

making art. Yeah. Which I kind of like fuck with Loki because he just like went like, all right, I’m just going to inspire a bunch of like young Canberra youth kids to make these things. And then boom, just gone. I’m gone. But yeah, he’s, he’s an amazing photographer. A lot of his work was like very fashion photography stuff, but like very like, I don’t know, it was like very like beautiful, like color wise.

He was very on the opposite spectrum, very like orange, red, sort of like very happy neutral colors. Um, but his work was, yeah, it was like very beautiful stuff and he documented it so well, especially in Canberra as well. Like it’s so hard to do that sometimes. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. But yeah.

How do you spell his name? Um, Arnd, A-R-N-D-A. I’m not sure if he has stuff on the internet anymore, but I’ll try and see if I can find anything and I’ll send it to you guys. Yeah. Thanks. Sick. But yeah, those are some very cool people. Yeah, for sure.

What else, dude? Are you playing anything at the moment? Are you playing any games? Um, League of Legends. Yeah. Yeah. Who’s going to like? That’s really hard. I don’t have the means and the setup to be able to play games anymore. Yeah. My MacBook only runs League of Legends and that’s kind of, it’s so sad. It’s really sad.

It’s actually so sad. Yeah. I’ve been climbing way too hard and spending way too much time on that game.

But yeah, that’s the only thing. What about you guys? Have you guys been playing anything? Yeah. Older Gate? Starfield. Yeah, I was playing Starfield. Okay. And I’ve been playing, do you know PES, like Pro Evolution Soccer? Yeah. PES live season update 2021. I’ve been playing for like five years. So, so why PES over FIFA?

What’s, what’s the? Like there’s just, I mean, FIFA is just, FIFA is not even a football scene.

It’s pretty shit these days. I’m about having like the latest roster. I just want it to feel like real football, you know? Yeah. When you make a pass, I want it to feel like I’m really kicking a ball. Yeah. And PES played that for me and I’m up to like the top difficulty, Superstar. Okay. I play like three games against the computer.

Like that’s a session and I’m just fucking dialed in. Just locked in. Just locked to the fuck in. I’d probably like to hear. And it’s, you know, like, I guess there’s like sim games, like, you know, you get so fucking busy. It’s like hard to find time to play like a big open world RPG, like, you know, so they work really, it’s just like a, it’s super isolated and it’s, yeah.

I don’t know. I really like sports and watching sports. So it’s kind of like part of that where it’s like kind of the same thing again and again and again. I mean, lots of like online games like that. Yeah. I mean, like CS or you’re playing like COD or something. And like from one perspective, you’re just doing the same fucking thing again and again for like 300 hours.

But every moment feels unique and exciting. So, yeah, it’s kind of, it’s kind of crazy how it’s so addicting. Like these games are just like, I don’t know. It’s so fried. It’s so bad for you. Honestly, like from someone who’s been playing League of Legends, like I don’t know how I’ve been playing League of Legends from the age of 12.

And I’m like 22 now. It’s like a 10 year anniversary of just playing League of Legends, which is insane to me. I don’t know. I haven’t been so sick of it. But no, I agree. It’s so crazy how like there’s certain points in the game where you’re just like, even though it’s so repetitive, it’s just like, oh my God, such a new feeling. Like you feel this adrenaline rush.

Yeah. It’s same thing with like taking photos. Fuck. I’m just fucking walking around. You can take the same damn photo, but sometimes it’ll feel a little different. Yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah. I don’t get the same exact feeling of like adrenaline usually with photos, but I completely get the like addictiveness. Like I’ve been like the last couple of months I’ve been especially like staunch about having a camera on me and I’m like constantly stopping the fucking convoy to go and like pulling over to take photos and stuff like that.

Like all the time. And yeah, it’s just like, it’s just like constantly on my mind. Like, yeah. Yeah. No, I’ve had that same thing. It’s just good to always carry around a camera. Yeah. I know. And like, as I was talking about, like, as I was like, it’s kind of, um, speaking on what Aiden was talking about, just like the adrenaline rush. Like I get that so much with photos sometimes.

Sometimes like you’ll just have this weird sort of like, I don’t know, like fascinating moment and or like idea. You’re just like, oh my God, that’s the one. Like you just get so excited about it. You can spend so much time in one spot. Yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah. Can I ask about like, maybe like for example, that train photo or any others, that street photography moment.

We’ve kind of, Matt and I have been sort of dancing around that as like a genre and some things we like and don’t like about it. But like, do you have that moment of like capture, especially like a stranger, like in public? Yeah. Yeah. A hundred percent. Sometimes, um, sometimes I feel really bad about it just because it’s like, obviously almost an invasion of privacy, but kind of in that sense, I think that’s what photography really is.

Like, it really is just an invasion of privacy, full stop. Um, just because you’re always kind of like taking a photo of a specific moment, whether or not someone knows, um, you’re basically just like kind of building this character and this idea and model of somebody through this image. Um, but yeah, the whole, I don’t know, street photography, just taking photos of people all the time.

It’s just like, I personally try and tend to be discreet about it just because it’s so much more like natural. And I, you get that, like anyone could tell you that, but yeah, it’s just so much more natural and just like very genuine. And it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s just basically just having, taking a photo of someone at their most, like, I would say, um, personal and submissive state almost just because like, they don’t know you’ve done it.

And you’re like, they’re just kind of doing their own natural thing. And like, you’ve got this whole image that’s just them. And it’s just like them doing their thing. Like, I don’t know if that kind of makes sense, but, um, yeah, it’s just like very like, yeah, invasion of privacy sort of thing. And like people can get like pretty like scared about it. And it is kind of like, I’d say fucked and fried just because like, obviously not everyone wants to have an image of them floating somewhere around on the internet.

But I think that comes with also just being out and about all the time. And like, also like with this day and age of like, like cameras, like, especially with governments and whatnot, like they’re always watching you full stop. So it’s just like point. Yeah. It’s like, you know, like our personal data and like our images are probably like, yeah, like deeply like stored and like just all over the place in terms of like just straight up collection purposes.

But like, yeah. How many like beautiful portraits are there of me just like out on the street? Like, I don’t know. Exactly. It’s kind of like even more like of a beautiful, like a way more beautiful thing to do, like, you know, or to have happen to you in public than just like, yeah, we got you on CCTV like 50 times today and you don’t even know.

I don’t know exactly. So it’s like whenever like, yeah, whenever at least when I’m going out and taking photos, like street photos, I kind of think of that. And it’s like, honestly, like if this person is kind of bothered, then I’m sorry. But also like just to remind you that this fucking shop front has fucking like at least 100 photos of you. Yeah.

True. So, yeah. I know. I always take that in mind. It’s just like, yeah. When you’re doing street photography stuff, you got to kind of like have that sort of idea out of your head. Yeah. Kind of just be like, fuck it. Like, yeah. I’m taking a photo of you. Yeah. It’s happening. So like you’re saying you’re, there’s a sense of some sense of respect with like the, the, um, what did you say?

Um, being discreet, some element of expression. You’re not being a wanker. Like, I mean, you have to be brave as well. Like I, I am quite scared to take photos of, you know, especially with my big stupid zoom lens. It’s super creepy. Yeah. You’re just like all up in their face.

Like I’m just so ready. You’re just like fucking taking this fucking big ass photo of you. I need a new lens like quick. But yeah, like sometimes there’s, um, yeah, I feel like as I’m learning, it feels much more comfortable to take photos where people are not the central subject. Yeah. You know, objects or it’s, and, but yeah, I mean, people are fascinating.

So, you know. No, people are fascinating. I would kind of want to be like, I want this, this moment has that spark and I want to capture it. I want to do something with it. Like whether or not it involves people, like it should almost be agnostic. Yeah. A hundred percent. Area, like obviously. Yeah. Yeah. I’ve taken, I’ve taken that sort of like idea and philosophy into like other areas being like sort of inanimate objects.

And also just like, I think, um, animals and like dead animals. Um, just because, yeah, sometimes when you are going out for a street photograph, like it’s just kind of hard to be able to be like, oh, okay. Like I want to take photos of people because sometimes you’ll just have that sort of feeling where you’re just like very nervous and kind of scared of it. But I’ve applied that sort of like idea onto like pictures of like, like, yeah, from that last post was like of that dead bird and like horses.

Um, it’s just like, yeah, you just kind of just have, have that sort of, you just got to keep that sort of mentality really just to kind of just like say whatever and fuck it. And, um, I don’t know. I think it just, yeah, I know sometimes I, I don’t know. When I think about street photography, it’s kind of hard because it’s like, obviously you don’t want to kind of overstep someone’s boundaries, especially if you don’t know them.

But like, if you’re making fine artwork and like the thing about photography is it’s so hard to be able to even like kind of create something like that genuine full stop. Yeah. But it’s like, sometimes you just have to do it and sacrifice it. It’s whatever. Yeah. I think it’s, it’s like always pretty much always going to be worth the try. Right. Like that’s a really good point that like, like that, that sort of image, like that image that you took of the guy on the train, like that’s such a tender, like rare, super rare moment.

Like, you can’t just like make that up in a studio, you know, like, like, if he’s a little bit offended or something, but it’s like also, damn, you know, like how, how else are people going to see this kind of expression like printed or like their iPhone, like for God’s sake. Yeah. Yeah, no, exactly. And yeah, he was, he was, I don’t know, like he could, you could see it as, yeah, he’s, he’s in a very vulnerable state, of course.

But like, yeah, I don’t know. It’s just like, it’s just so crazy. Cause yeah, you don’t get that every day. Yeah. You won’t be able to kind of recreate that, especially with like lighting. Like, um, but yeah, I don’t know. It’s, it’s, it’s pretty, yeah. I don’t know. It’s, it’s pretty crazy, but yeah, street photography is pretty hard. It’s like over, it’s a very overly done medium, but it is a very like hard thing to do.

Yeah. To be like, to make some stuff out of it. Actually make it good. Yeah. I know there’s, there’s this huge, like cult of like street photography, like mostly dudes like online on Instagram and there’s lots on YouTube as well. And so many of them take just pretty boring photos, you know, it’s kind of just like the photos, you know, it’s just, I was here at, in this moment and like a very few of them are sort of sensitive and interesting, beautiful photos.

Yeah. I find that on like photography boards. Like I usually like surf the 4chan photography boards and most of the time when they’re doing street photography stuff, it is very like, I don’t know. Most of the stuff is, it feels very touristy, tourist, touristy. Does that? Yeah. Yeah. But yeah, it just feels like almost like a tourist sort of like image, like whatsoever.

I don’t know. Most of the people that post on 4chan, sometimes you’ll find a fucking awesome image on 4chan, but yeah, I don’t know. It’s the same thing. Like just obsessed. People on 4chan are like obsessed with like fucking camera gears and whatnot, which is like awesome. I love that. But it’s like also like, I don’t know, most of the photos that they post are just like so like wanky and kind of just like boring.

Yeah. Isn’t it funny that like, it seems without kind of a fine art perspective, like this kind of pretentious thing to say, but like, it seems like across a bunch of art forms, like the kind of consensus lands with a lot of gear stuff. Like you find it in music, you know, it’s like, we’re obsessed with gear and we’re obsessed with technicalities and we can make like good images, quote unquote, as in like correct images or like the instrument or the note sounds how it should.

But it’s just, it’s crazy. It’s just like that stuff, like it really accumulates and grows around that. And no, like no one even seems to ask like, uh, you know, the questions you would ask yourself as an artist or like the questions you would be asked in art school. Like, you know, does this like touch my soul? Is it moving?

Does it have punctuation? It’s just like, is it correct? And it’s just crazy how like, I mean, it makes sense to me that that would, some people’s interests would fall that way, like more technically and more cleanly. Like, you know, it’s very clean and neat. but to see that that has not only like caught up on some people but it’s like the predominant way

of you know on like reddit photography reddit boards it’s very much the same like a lot of kind of soulless or like the reddit art is just photorealistic drawings yeah Hermione yeah photorealistic drawing of Hermione smoking a blunt is that the main thing that’s like

unfortunately if you don’t get some fucking like I don’t know is it theory or something like that’s just kind of where we humans have like decided to land yeah yeah I think I think in saying that I think one thing about VCA that’s really good um is it’s contemporary and like sort of like conceptual

side just because yeah people yeah people are really crazy about like technicality and like I think it’s like it’s a great thing like to be able to understand the rules of thirds and like where to put center stuff like whatever else but I think in a sort of way it’s like you want to

distinguish your work and like kind of be I guess different which you really can’t in this day and age it’s like everyone does something and you’re inspired and kind of like reference something that’s been done already full stop but yeah I know I think it’s just like it’s just crazy to be able to like kind of take that into like a very serious note when you’re kind of like making so much work like

you kind of need to step outside the box like yeah such a such a like cliche thing to say but like it’s true like you kind of just need to step outside the box and kind of like not take something that seriously like a lot of the time I take my photos at an angle I don’t even be fucking like squaring it up I’m always like this yeah it’s like it’s like it’s like how I don’t know like in

tv shows or like cartoons when police officers like fucking holding their gun to the side like yeah that’s kind of how I just take most like my photos or like anything that I do creatively and just like just don’t take it that seriously it’s like just do your thing kind of look cool at it like fuck it cool that’s good advice I think for like young artists actually that’s a good one like

do you have any advice like you know that you wish you’d heard when you were like 14 15 16 like picking up a camera and like you know what would I say what would I say I would probably um don’t take this shit too seriously yeah do your thing and it all comes together um you’ll find your

you’ll find your swag your aesthetic it all happens it all happens it all comes in you’ll manifest it at some point in time um but yeah just have fun with it really um if I if I could if I could tell myself something like that like when I was like 15 taking photos on a camera just have fun like

enjoy your time and collect just collect images especially as a photographer and and a painter just collect keep making stuff like don’t stop it’s always just nice to look back at your at your own work like you’ll you’ll like thank yourself you’ll just be like holy shit I’m so thankful I’ve kind of just like come from this and then now I’m here yeah so it’s just like yeah just keep doing your thing

just keep making like sometimes it’s hard to do that and I’ve definitely gone through it like currently but I think having that sort of like portfolio of work to look back at it’s kind of inspires you to kind of get back into it just keep going let’s see definitely that’s something I’d probably tell myself all emerging young artists yeah cool I still definitely need advice like I’m still

lost that’s also one thing keep looking out for like mentors and like ask for advice always because yeah yeah that’s something I definitely struggle with have you received any like particularly good advice um oh something as of recent I’ve been told um honestly I don’t remember sometimes I just

just just just goes through one year and comes out the other just because I’m just like very picky with the advice from certain lecturers I respect um but one thing is basically what I just said like they kind of just told me they were like just be proficient in it like who cares just keep taking photos just keep doing your thing just keep making stuff like that’s really it and I was like yeah

that’s actually honestly like the best thing I can really get currently especially when I was like at that point in time when I wasn’t taking as many photos just because I was like in a rut but yeah it’s just always just keep doing your thing like don’t even stop because with art like comes time like most artists and like don’t become well renowned or something especially at like a very old age like

at a young age like you have to be like some at some point probably like 50 or something and you’ll probably have like this massive catalog of work where people kind of like respect yeah but yeah just keep making just keep doing your thing various part right it was like why I was like at a certain point like writing poems writing poems and I was like I fucking this is too scary to think I might be like working in a

kitchen and writing poems and so I like went and learned to code for a few years and I got a lot of money and then I like came back to it because it’s just it’s too scary to like be in that abyss like you just if you’re not getting any wins you just have to like I’m gonna keep going yeah keep going and you’re like 5 30 like I’m gonna keep going no I mean I guess that’s with all art really in general anyways I think like yeah most of my

lecturers are like practicing artists yeah like they they still make art but yeah they’re just teaching like that’s their job yeah that’s what they have to do but yeah that’s just art full stop like you’re gonna have to like keep doing stuff until like obviously you hit it but it is what it is like yeah so yeah I guess they’re like the stuff that they told me is just something that they’d gone

through so it’s always good to listen to that yeah it’s always nice to have that sort of in your ear yeah definitely definitely that’s something I’d probably tell yeah young people yeah good advice really good advice um we’re coming up to our hour should we think about wrapping it up chaps I think yeah yeah do you have any anything you want to shout out like any shows coming up I think

you’ve got like some prints coming out soon yeah um so yeah um I’m working on hopefully a full book um titled shivering um also hopefully having a show but off-site pretty soon so if anyone from Sydney or Melbourne is listening or anywhere in the world would like to come along that will be

probably hopefully announced very soon but show wise not too sure um Melbourne people fuck with me um put me on nah but um yeah that’s basically it just working on a lot of stuff just working on like hopefully a book that’s one thing that I kind of want to get done yeah great beautiful cool um so lovely to catch up with you dude it’s been ages yeah you too you guys as well it’s been

way too long it’s been like a year and a half I know yeah we should definitely link up and um I’ll like come and visit we’ll we’ll take some photos and stuff yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I’m hopefully coming to Sydney at some point so yeah let’s know you guys got to take me to some some upcoming new shows as well because I need to I need to be tapped in with all the people in Sydney I kind of want to I want to meet all these new artists I haven’t met before yeah there’s a really cool scene at the

moment yeah we’ll we’ll link you up with with people yeah for sure yeah I’ve been I’ve been seeing some crazy stuff it’s been fucking awesome to see I like I love seeing that for Sydney go Sydney yeah New South Wales I love you too Melbourne but yeah go Sydney that’s my home I’m not even from Sydney but but yeah all right man we’ll talk awesome yeah awesome thank you so much love you guys

yeah love you bye bye so that’s that that was so fucking fun dude yeah I feel like I’ve had a little dip like I was obsessed with photography and then some other stuff came up and then there’s been a little dip and then just like convos like this and everyone around me it’s like photos are back around again you know what I mean yeah 100% yeah photos are cool again

what is it cool again for me photos got cool um what are we saying to the listeners um share leave a review that kind of stuff review that’s cool if you’ve been like listening to like five ten episodes can you tell us give us a review and be like this is what I like like on Spotify or Apple or whatever it is yeah um yeah still um still trucking along adhering to our um

core mission statements well actually Tun lives in Melbourne so technically an illicit guest but they love Sydney so it’s allowed yeah true they they like huge Sydney fan genuinely yeah I wasn’t expecting that but it was very sweet yeah hell yeah cool greatest city in the world

greatest city in the world baby all right that’s all all right speak soon bye-bye building oh

I knew that.

Coming on, just coming on to chit chat. Ooh, you’re alright. Hanging out and stealing all the limelight. Messing with the beat of my heart. Ooh, messing with the beat of my heart, yeah.

He used to be a mean kid. Make it such a deal of life.

Ooh, you’re wishing and hoping and waiting to really… father who gave us one another two minutes later and asking his wife and wife

Show notes

Last time we saw Tun, he and Mika (shoutout @uumebayashi) were running an art show from a tiny flat above king street. Shortly after that, Tun moved south to study at VCA. This catch-up call covers art photography, fashion photography, modelling, league of legends, the story behind Tun’s username @childsoldierr,   follow @hungup.au on instagram for updates