3.10 New Ari - Tiles Lewisham | Studio visit - Kitchen Marrickville

Transcript

Welcome back to Hung Up. This is Aiden. My name’s Matt. This week we’re talking new Ari’s, artist studios, new galleries, inner west. We’re also talking like non white cube stuff and like how does community and the outer world come into your place of work or place of show. True. And I’m like on the one hand I’m into it and on the other hand I’m like a little bit suspicious. Ooh, I didn’t see that one coming. Yeah, you didn’t see that one coming because sometimes it feels like a little bit more.

It feels like lip service. Uh, as in like we would be paying lip service to like just any cool new gallery that we see or something. Or the gallery slash studio space is like we care so much about the community. Right, right. Really you kind of have to say that but whatever.

Interesting. Not to be. I love the red hot take right out of the gates. That’s very on form for you. Yeah, not to be a downer about it but um, you know, let’s just let’s just be real too. Yeah, please. It’s not fucking community service like an art gallery. Hmm. Um, but let’s let’s okay. We’ll get into that. We’ll get into that. Yeah, whatever.

It was just it was just on my mind. So let’s go chronological. First up we’ve got um, our like little interview with uh, Olga and Chris from tiles gallery. Um, they were like there when we were checking it out on Sunday. And so a really cool show which we’ll go over because we wanted to tie this tiles interview in with a discussion that I just had like a couple of hours ago with Mariana and Mackenzie from kitchen.

And some of the lads there. Um, kind of about some of the same topics and then plugging some shows and like just walking around their studio meeting the cute little dog that lives there and stuff. Yeah, this is a good episode if you’re interested in like how an re works or how to set up a studio and also just some insight into these like cool new spaces in Sydney.

Yeah. Um, hear from some of the people who are making them and practicing out of them. Yeah, I was saying we should just get a list going like what are all the like non, you know, big ass commercial spaces popping up like it’d be cool to just do a Google Doc that everyone can look at. Yeah, that would be dope. All right, cool. So you hear from Olga and Chris two of the founders of tiles in Lewisham.

I’ll be the mic guy. What are your names? I’m Aiden. I’m Chris. And I’m Olga. Yeah. Okay, cool. So we just showed up to tiles.

We’ve been scoping this gallery out for a little while seeing it online and just moseyed on down here on Sunday Alvo and it was a beautiful show. And we bumped into a couple of artists outside. Maybe you guys could just introduce yourself and yeah, I’m Chris Burton. Um, I started this with my friend Marcus. Um, I’m printmaking background from Canberra and did art school in Canberra at ANU.

And I work at the Art Garden South Wales in install and we kind of formed almost part of a collective. And I’ve now started this space along with that. Um, I’m Olga Svetova. I am also part of tiles founders, I guess. Um, and yeah, I’m working mostly with photography.

Um, and it’s been a long journey for us to start this place. Uh, but we are really proud and we really would like to support like emerging artists in Sydney and give them space to be shown. Um, hmm.

And we wanted to know what, uh, the space was used for before. Because we noticed it’s like, yeah, obviously it’s called tiles and it’s covered in these echoey multicolored tiles. Yeah. So we, it’s believed it was a butcher originally. Um, and this place has a bit of a colorful history. Um, during back, I think two years ago, there was a tattoo parlor and I think like bikies were kind of like running it.

And yeah, there was quite, quite a few events here that kind of like, it was quite intense and bad for the neighborhood. Oh shoot. Yeah. So when we kind of took it over, we definitely like a lot of the neighborhood kind of like came together and was like very happy that something creative was happening here. And, you know, it kind of changed the whole vibe of the streets and everything.

So yeah. Yeah. That’s cool. Yeah. We never let you guys go. I got a question. Something we talk about on this podcast a lot is like white cube vibes and like, I don’t know, this feeling of like a art gallery being some other outside of life space. And like one of the cool things about like taking over a place with a history and it’s so like, obviously has a history.

That’s like part of the feeling of being in that show. Yeah. Yeah. Is that it like refuses that white pube. Like you can’t pretend like you’re in a space outside of everyday life. Like I feel like we just walked past the cafe and now we’re walking into the gallery and that’s like such a sexy thing. I don’t know. Just get some thoughts on that. It’s also like kind of like artists or initiatives kind of like, it’s kind of like using what you’ve got as well.

It’s kind of like the ethos of just being like, we have the space. Let’s just get out on the walls and let’s open up to people and the community and bring people in and start something. Like I think less about trying to make it like, yeah, that kind of generic form and making it a bit different. Yeah. Make it more approachable. We spent quite a lot of time to like figure out what, how we want the gallery looks like.

And yeah, firstly, it was like, oh, let’s just build the walls. But when it’s, you know, money comes as a big question and like time. And at some point we realized that we can’t get rid of tiles. Like, tiles are going to be stay here.

And I think this is something what some people would like to work with. Like, it’s always going to be a feature of the gallery. And I think the good thing about it, because it’s like so many tiles, you actually don’t need to feel the space completely.

It’s already something there and you just need to like space to complementing your works and you complementing the space with your works. Yeah, it seems fairer, like more fair on, on the artist and the, the audience, you know, to have it bleed into the history of the space and have to kind of maybe compromise your, your art a little bit in some way, but it doesn’t feel like a compromise.

It just feels like making something suit. Yeah, totally. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, that was awesome. A really, really solid show. Is there another one? Because I think this will come out after this show ends. But have you guys got another show in the works? Yeah, it’s my show coming up, my solo show. It’s on the opening night. It’s on the first of June, which is also my birthday.

Yeah, so if people would like to come to check it out, everyone is welcome. It’s called Philia, which is the, it’s a Greek word, which means the highest form of love for friends. So the show is about friendship.

We’ll make sure to get a couple of people to come. Yeah. Yeah. Well, thanks so much. Yeah. It’s really nice to meet you guys. Okay. Um, I had no idea what to expect because I didn’t look at any pictures for the show.

So I just got to go in totally blindfolded, which was kind of cool. Yeah, me either. I mean, I think tiles popped up around the same time as prop. Like I saw them getting like posted on Instagram, like check out these two new Ari’s. And that’s pretty much all I knew. And I knew it had some kind of like, some of the like pictures of the space.

Like I knew it was unorthodox. Like it looked like an old restaurant, like a canteen. Turns out it’s a butchery or was a butchery as you just heard. Um, but it’s really cool to go into a show kind of like completely, uh, blind like that. Right? Yeah. I heard someone on FBI being like, I don’t like watching trailers before going to see

the movie. And I was like, me too. Fucking me too. Like times. Absolutely. Me too. Yeah. I fucking hate a trailer. There you go. The trailer. Where were you a couple of weeks ago, dude? I was, I got into trouble. Someone like got me into trouble for not wanting to watch the trailer. That’s fucked. Now we’re just looking at my emails.

No, I’m looking at the, uh, like I was trying to do it without you fucking being a, a dickhead about it. Breaking the third wall. Exactly. But, uh, I wanted to see what the show was called unless you remember. Cause I had like a kind of a funny name. It was called like too much. No, it was called like soft touch. No, it was called like not enough.

It was called like spot on. Spot on. Bang on. It was called like on point. Here we go. Top notch. Top notch. So yeah, this show was called top notch. I didn’t like, we didn’t read anything really about it. Um, so the first thing that jumped out to me was this, uh, big work that ended up kind

of being my favorite, I think from the show. Um, it’s called carrier bag and it’s done by Maury, which is like a kind of like a collaborative project, I guess, between Umi Graham and Janelle Wu. Um, and it’s like a big, well, I’ll just read the materials. It’s like an installation, a screen print on salvage fabric, organza, cotton thread, utility rope.

Fuck. Carabiners bead charms, Ursula, Ursula K. Le Guin’s carrier bag theory of fiction. Dimensions variable. Um, and yeah, so to me it was kind of like, it looked like something that someone really cool would take to a doff. Like that was the first thing that went to my mind. I was like, fuck yeah. The artists are like making their own like doff bags.

It’s like a satchel, but also maybe once you’re there, you unpack all your food and books from it and it becomes like a bit of a, an awning or a tent. Um, and then like, you know, at night you can like hang a torch from one of the little like technical rope things. And yeah, like the, the high strength rope and carabiners are sort of talking to this sort

of very organic looking, like maybe natural dye and yeah, repurposed fabric. Um, and just that sort of tension and harmony was just, it really struck me. And I was thinking about it today actually. Um, so that was my favorite. It was just, it’s also like, I guess just a pleasure to look at like, um, sort of unfurled like this.

I really want to see it like styled. I want to see someone in like cool shoes and like with a cool haircut, like slinging it over their shoulder, like in a muddy doff field, you know, that’s my editorial fashion magazine, like imagination of this. Yeah. It’s got like, I don’t know. I don’t think you’ve read that. The Le Guin’s theory of fiction, although I know you’re a big fan of her.

Yeah. She’s writing. Cool. It’s got like a little sleeve, like where you could put that book or like another little, like a book of poems or something, which is fits into this like narrative that we’re building of this, like, I don’t know, like learned doffer. Yeah. It’s like conscientious. Yeah. They’re like, they’re like, yeah.

Sustained artistic practice. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. They’re at the doff, but they’ve got like some serious stuff to read for like a reading series that they’re presenting. And they’re actually going to read it. And they actually, yeah. Yeah. And they like know what all the DJs are and are really into it. And like respectfully gacked off of their fucking dome.

Yeah. They got like real drugs. They’re doing MDMA, not PEMAs. Yeah, exactly. And it was interesting when you heard from the interview, we weren’t recording at this time, but Olga was kind of walking us through the studios and kind of the last room we came to was Maury’s studio. So they kind of, they are the two, did you say the artist names or the architects?

Yeah. Umie Graham and Janelle Wu. And they kind of like, uh, Olga was saying that they are like architects by trade. Like they have day jobs as architects. I mean, I guess that itself could be pretty broad, but it’s always interesting. Like when we were in their studio, like it definitely felt like there was a lot of like theoretical heft, like in the room, like you could just sense it.

True. And I think that’s interesting to, to like consider that they’re coming, you know, not to pigeonhole them, but like I was reading part of that into this work, like that they were coming from a place of architecture, you know, it’s not just straight up. Like, um, you know, I got a BFA or I got an MA or whatever.

It’s like adjacent. Yeah. It looks like very much like art. And I was saying like, it reminds me of like Nadia Hernandez’s work at, I can’t remember what the gallery’s called. Station gallery. Yeah. It’s a commercial gallery in the cross, but, uh, she was using some of this stuff too, right? Like canvases and carabiners and technical materials.

Um, yeah. Another thing that I didn’t really mention was the little like decorative bead, like pendants. It reminded me of like being in primary school and like putting together cute little, um, bracelets with these beads on them. I wonder if I got a picture of it somewhere. Um, yeah, that kind of like childhood like meets.

Yeah. There’s one. It’s like childhood meets like, you know, serious technical fabrics, but sort of like keeping it playful and like immature in, in years, like in that way, just it’s, it’s like the, the beads are attached with these like sort of metal, um, key rings onto like loops that

have been sewn on. So it’s this funny kind of like just meeting of, um, what’s the word I’m looking for? Like technical and like practical, like sort of necessary moorings. And then like these decorative things. It’s cool. It’s like sort of this fun meeting place of a lot of things. Oh yeah. And then another thing is like, it’s like they have a sort of care instruct, like wash instructions

kind of thing. And it goes like 70% cotton, 25% ornament, 4% function, 1% still working through it. Fair enough. Hand wash with a friend, treat stains and marks tenderly. Take time to drip dry slowly. Fold me up carefully. Carry me with you. Handmade on bidjigal and gadigal country. Always was, always will be.

And that is actually printed on a really nice, like fabric that I didn’t clock when we were there. What is that table chair plant book? It’s like suggesting uses for it. It’s like, you could like put a plant in it and like display it like that. It carries a book. It could like wrap or be a chair or it’s like a table and it’s like a picnic rug, you know,

that’s kind of like a table. That’s kind of like a table. I actually love this detail of it. I think it reminds me of like some like kind of high fashion stuff you would see like some high fashion like labels or like when you get like a kind of expensive pair of shoes or something when it has those like handmade touches. And that just feels like very much the kind of like place where you would find those.

So I wonder if they’re drawing on that a little bit. Yeah. And I also like in the materials list, the dimensions variable. That’s beautiful. Like instantly made me think of like all the different ways you could use this thing. Yeah. And yeah, I mean, it’s yeah. I mean, we could go on and on, but I think that’s a really fucking cool like theoretical

decision to make because like it’s big and it’s cumbersome and like it’s a little bit ugly to me. And I think probably to like most people off the street. I didn’t get ugly at all. Not to Matt. No. But like to me, it’s a little bit of an ugly object. It’s got like where the material has been like kind of dyed in these random organic ways.

It kind of looked like, looks like stains or like moldy or just like dirty. Um, but yeah, like it’s, it’s like fashion and it’s like a bag and it’s like, but also super static, like in the gallery. Right. Like it’s, it’s kind of just being like a, it’s not being itself in the, yeah, yeah, yeah.

At night. It’s like, just like flat. You can’t even really, well, you probably shouldn’t touch it. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. Until you buy it. No, until you buy it. Cool, man. Was it for sale? Yeah, it was for sale. NFS. You can’t even fucking buy it. Even if you think it’s cool. Sorry guys.

Even if you have lots of money. It’s never allowed to live. Well, maybe they use it. Yeah. They use it for their cute, like architectural picnics. I think it’s a picnic. I wonder what that would look like. What, what cheeses and like cold cuts do you bring to like a picnic with these guys? Like they’re serious. You know what I mean? It could go like, it could go. I would just go like one cheese.

I would just go one cheese. I would just go one cheese. Yeah. Or it could also go like vegan cheese. Oh, yeah. Okay. Like on a bad day. Probably just count me out then. I’m actually busy that day. So. Okay. Cool. So, the next piece that kind of like really jumped out to us was this by Monica Rani Rudar.

Do you want to read out the materials and titles? There’s like, yeah. What do we got here? We’ve kind of got like three pieces playing together. Two kind of like ceramic vases. One’s on a plinth. One’s on a shelf. One’s on a shelf. It’s like this kind of shiny glazed earth tone. And then in the middle of them is kind of like, it’s like a hanging and it’s made up

of dried chilies and star anise. So, it’s like a rectangle kind of, it’s hung and there’s two golden circles and then there’s some thread. And then, yeah, I guess like it’s kind of cool to think of it like a little painting, but it’s bordered by star anise all the way around.

And then there’s like seven or eight like vertical rows of like dried chilies. And then what are these down the bottom? Are those? I can’t remember those. I think those were more ceramic. Okay. Little pendants or there could be little cardamom. Oh, they could be little spices. But we can zoom in on a different picture if you want. No, that’s okay. Yeah.

We can see from the material list. But yeah, so there was like, I really liked the feeling of these three together. Like they were very kind of like harmonic. Like obviously the two ceramics are made of the same stuff and they have the same kind of idea. They’re just these kind of vases and they have kind of like little windows on them, like little openings.

Yeah. Almost little, I was saying like little altars or little shrines in them. Like, yeah. With like, yeah, one has like these delicate golden threads kind of like looping out of the mouth of the vase. And the other one, the smaller one is very sweet. It had these like, around the like mouth of it was like studded with cardamom.

And I was like, as I was like leaning and like a necklace. Yeah. You could get like a big whiff of them. Yeah. That’s right. Yeah. We smelled it. We smelled cardamom. And their studio as well was like a bunch more of this stuff. And they’re really beautiful. Like we didn’t really say, but it’s gorgeous. Like to look out. They’re so cool.

Okay. So I’m definitely getting like, yeah, this like kind of connection to food and like, therefore your culture and like, you know, like the importance of that and like reverence of that, you know, I was kind of showing you like, they are little, um, ceramic pendants on the bottom. Cool. Cool.

Cool. Cool. Cool. And that’s also joined up with like gold wire and gold chain. Yeah. Sort of like, it’s almost like a weave or something, but yeah, it’s, it’s cool. It’s, it sort of defies like explanation in some way. Cause it’s, it’s a very unique object. Kind of like halfway between a carpet and like a decorative weave and. Yeah. Also like, I think, I don’t know.

I haven’t seen too many like hanging spices. It was reminding me of like garlic for vampires or something. It’s like, you feel spices on the wall, like, yeah, off the. Beautiful. Yeah. They’re not too heavy handed. They’re not too in your face. They’re very much maintaining like an artistic distance. It’s not like, ha ha. This is just like, I’ve just taken something that I would have seen in my grandma’s kitchen

and like fucking put it on the wall. Like, it’s cool because you know, whatever, like it’s cool because that food is cool. It’s definitely making that like artistic transformation. Like there’s like a delicacy. There’s like a brittleness. There’s obviously it’s like reminding you of cooking. I just like happened to be cooking a bunch of like Ottolenghi shit and grinding cinnamon

and cardamom and turmeric like on the weekend. And it just like, I don’t know. It was just a nice kind of moment. And just looking at the image now, like as we sit on your couch, like the fucking tile space that we spoke so much in the interview is like so loud here. Like the fucking tiles on the floor.

And then these, what are these like flowers like on a top painted on the tiles? Like, and I noticed that like the plinth that the bigger of those two pots or urns is on. It’s like sort of placed carefully in this little square border of tiles. Like a four by four, like sort of square or rectangle. And it’s kind of like, like, yeah, we were sort of talking about that.

Like how the space sort of imposes some of its own vibe on your show. And you have no choice but to kind of cater to that, which I think we were saying we all agreed is very much more like real life than. Well, that’s what a home does, right? That’s what we all have to do. We’re like, oh, this is where the desk will have to go because this is where the, where it fits. Where it fits.

And that’s, this is where my bed goes. Cause this is where the PowerPoint is and blah, blah, blah. Um, but what do you think? I thought this too was cool. So there’s like, there’s just so many different, um, tiled elements that, uh, the artist is forced to play with. Yeah. So they’ve hung the, the top of that hanging work is off of like, what could be like the picture rail height of the tiles.

It’s got a decorative, like octagon and line kind of repeating pattern. Very beautiful. I always love like black glazed ceramics, especially when they’re next to white glazed ceramics. Very special. I love that crack too. There’s like a big crack running through like nine tiles. Yeah. I wonder, it would be cool to see, to hear from the artists and get some of their take on, you know, is it, is it fun to have to play with the room or is it annoying?

Like usually I always hear that people enjoy constraint. Yeah. Like, Oh, cool. I’ve got to fit my work in this tiny room. Like I’ll show this or I’ll show that. Like if it was me, I would too. Yeah. We’ll get a couple of takes DM us if you would prefer to go white cube or like a gallery with heaps of like constraints.

All right. Thank you so much, Monica. That work was dope. Beautiful. Yeah. Let’s talk about the dog. Can we talk about the dog? Up, up, up, up. Or maybe down. I don’t know. Um, my brother. Okay. This is, uh, let me tee you up. Yeah. This was, yeah. Another work that we really dug from this show.

Owen Lewis, dog funeral, mixed materials. Um, so we’ll have to describe them to you. Dimensions variable and also not for sale. This one’s like a, a dog, uh, well, not a dog. Uh, um, a puppet, like a fabric puppet of a dog, uh, resting on this kind of wreath of native, um, flora.

And it’s kind of covered by this like blue, like classic Bunnings blue top with knotted ropes, kind of keeping it tied on. Um, and the dog’s head is kind of hanging over what would have been the edge of the, the, the butcher’s side of like a display shelf, I guess, for all the meats.

And yeah, we definitely, we definitely like got busted. Like we walked past it and we were like, um, oh, that’s just like some storage. And then we were like, oh, no, no, that is a work in, in the room sheet. Yeah, totally. But also the shelf it’s on, it was all like cracked and cooked. And I was trying to work out like, would people have been able to sit up, sit on that on like opening night or would it have like broken?

Yeah, true. I reckon no one sat on that. Yeah. Um, oh, and then actually I just noticed one of the knots of the rope, it looks like a, a banksia flower. See?

We didn’t even notice that on the day. That’s cool. Um, and yeah, the dog’s head is kind of hanging like, yeah, dead or dejected at least like over the edge of the shelf. And like, yeah, I shared it to a group I chat to online and everyone was like, oh, poor dog. It’s like, yeah, you feel for the dog. It’s a sad work. It’s the shape of a greyhound, like inner west beloved dogs. Yeah.

It’s a sad, it’s a sad work. And it’s, yeah, the way it’s like kind of, yeah, it’s tied up in this bag. Like it’s very much like there’s going away. Yeah. It’s going away for the, for, for good. Yeah. It’s cool to see a work that is like sad and messy and often like, I don’t know, like these works that feel a bit like sloppy or whatever.

Like sloppy in their presentation. Yeah. They’re not, I don’t know if this is far fetched or whatever, but I feel like they’re not as often like dealing with like such a like real subject. Like, uh, one of my like family members passed away recently and they had like a beloved dog. Like this dog got treated better than anyone.

Any kid. Yeah. Got everything it ever dreamed. And it was a rescue dog and it was originally a really anxious dog. Yeah. And it’s name is Tip and it’s a very beautiful dog. And I was at like a family gathering on the weekend and he was there and he was like depressed. He was depressed. Ouch. Ouch. But he was like getting all the love and it was very sweet.

Um, so yeah, I don’t know. It was just, it’s kind of like confronting, I suppose. I don’t know how often I’ve seen this like, um, depicted, but yeah, some really interesting material decisions as well. Right? Yeah. This looks like a really like coarse, like the fabric that the dog is made out of, like it’s really thick, chunky weaves and they’re, and the, the different colors.

It’s kind of got these bands of black, thin bands of, thin bands of black, um, try and say that 10 times fast and fat bands of yellow, both quite like natural looking and the, and the sort of ground itself, like the background color is also like a kind of Hessian or canvas yellow. So this show was fucking sick.

Like this show was dope. You could tell that there was like a lot of work that went into it. And I was like giddy when I got home. This really is like, for me, like as good as it gets in terms of like an art experience. We were really into it. And it really did, it really did this thing so beautifully of like, you’re in the gallery and now you’re on the street, like with no, there was no membrane or threshold to cross.

You know what I mean? It just something about the setup and the architecture and maybe the contents of the show, but just the transition was so smooth from one to the other. And I think we like, didn’t even notice walking in, you know what I mean? Yeah. We’re walking down the street and we walked past like the old sign. Yeah. And then I saw this, like a little two sided board, like a, with an A4 bit of paper that just was like gallery open, gallery open, gallery open.

I was like, Oh, that’s so sweet. Um, so yeah, huge agree. Yeah. There you go. I like, so that was our like entrance in and our experience. And then we’re like walking back to the car or whatever. And we walked past like the Lewisham grocer on the other side of the street. And there’s this kind of like rough looking. The vape shop. It was like the vape shop, but like slightly nicer.

But yeah, it was also the vape shop. And I noticed this, like, yeah, this tall, like maybe really, really young man, like 21, like a little bit rough around the edges. And you like stopped. And he like, he was like, yo, what’s up? Yeah. And I looked to my right and the dude from the shop is fucking playing chess outside. He’s got like a nice board and like a nice little table and chairs. And there’s maybe like what a 14 year old, like scared boy wearing like Uggs and sweatpants.

I didn’t see the Uggs. That’s awesome. He was fucking rocking some Uggs. A pimply little like nervous boy playing chess with the owner. They had just finished a game and they were resetting to go one more time. They just finished the game. And this guy was fucking cool, man. He was wearing like red sweater, like big glasses. And he’s like, what’s your name, dude? Like, what’s up? Dude.

And he tells us his name is Patrick. And he’s like, yeah, fucking play chess. He was like dying to have a game with us. Yeah. And he was like, stop and play. It was just beautiful. Like it was something out of like a sitcom. And I was like, I was imagining this guy, like you all know the vape shop guy. That’s like fucking having ciggies. And he’s like mad at the world. He’s checked out.

And he just has to see, he’s like decided that he has to like stand behind the thing forever or whatever. Like no hate. Like it was such a like elegant move for me. It was like, oh, bro. Like this guy, he owns this thing or whatever. Like he’s going to be there for 20 more years. Yeah. And he’s just like flipped it from potentially like a really boring, lonely time where you’re

like browsing the internet or watching fucking cricket. Yeah. Like the community and like chess. Yeah. What did he say? He’s like, we’re here every day. He’s like, we’re here every day. And he’s like, boys, watch out. Like it’s quiet now. But like 530. Yeah. This place fucking pops up. Yeah. 21 year old dude is like, yeah, it gets fucking busy. We got to go back. That’s cool.

What a spot. Fucking dope. And it was a competition for the gallery down the road. True. I wanted to like ask him if he’d seen Queen’s Gambit. What do you reckon? I want to know if he’s seen Top Notch. Top Notch. So yeah, like we fucking heard in the intro, you took a trip to Kitchen.

Where is that place? It’s near, it’s near like the Merrickville Metro. Oh yeah. True. Actually like neatly for our metaphor, you’ve got to go up a ramp to get there. So I was like, there’s just a little bit of an incline away from the street, you know, rather than tiles is like borderless, like, and entrainment with the just experience of

walking down that street. Okay. But let me get away with that. I’m not super happy about it. Okay. It’s getting late. Yeah. Um, this just like for the audience’s sake, you already, well, I don’t know if they’ve heard the interview yet, but, um, Kitchen is just a studio at the moment. So it’s, it’s kind of doing a different function to tiles, tiles with studio and a gallery.

But, um, yeah. What did you talk about? Um, so, and then we, so we talked about like, uh, the tiles show and we talked about how that membrane works, like how that threshold works. And then we also talked about, I was trying to like, I was calling them the CEOs about how this place started, how to set it up, um, troubles with the power.

Um, and like what’s next after, cause it’s not going to be a permanent thing, Kitchen, which they were all kind of feeling a bit sore about. You’re saying they had like a couple of kilns there. That’s fucking sick. Yeah. I was really impressed to see like two serious fucking kilns at it. Casey was like carefully placing things in gingerly, you know, you gotta like be really

thoughtful. He’s like, it’s going to take a whole day to cool down. I was like, fuck, that’s cool. I love how patient you have to be with that stuff. Yeah. You were saying something cool to me in the car on the way. And I noticed this at tiles too, just the fucking diligence it takes because this shit is not easy to open spaces, to open studios, to open galleries, you know, to put money on

the line when you don’t necessarily have much of it for a dedicated space. And you were kind of like, damn, like I was impressed with like everyone’s work ethic, but like, it makes sense too. Right. Like that the people that put this shit together, the people that are like, you know, these are the people that are like kind of grinding and really like going for it.

Yeah. That are like, you know, in the art trenches. Yeah. So yeah, it’s, it’s, it’s really exciting. It’s exciting for us too, I think, to, to be able to get close to it and to like, you know, not always see things from like an end product perspective. Exactly. The reason I was kind of like, I was like joking before we started recording, I was like, fuck

galleries or whatever. Like the gallery is one thing. And yes, in some ways it’s like all we’ve got, you know, for the culture, we were talking about private last episode and they kind of were blowing up some of that. But I’m like, just cause like the gallery is the way the gallery is like, it might, like

it makes sense that that format wouldn’t capture everything you want to say about making art like necessarily like that. It’s, it’s constrained and it’s, it’s performative and it’s limiting. And sometimes it fucking sucks. Yeah. So limiting the staticness of the gallery. So yeah. Unfortunately galleries do like pretty much always have to have this like mean, like,

um, commercial element. Even if you’re like a sweet Ari, it’s got to have a dollar sign in there. Like every now and then, you know? Yeah. Yeah. That’s one of the things that, yeah, it just, it’s the way the world works. And I’m on that side too. Like I ain’t going to be here. Like you fucking have to make it so experimental that you can’t pay your rent. Like that’s fucked. Yeah. I want you to be able to pay your rent.

I mean, good, good for you if you’re doing that, but yeah. Yeah. Conceptually. It’s just interesting to imagine, you know, ways that this stuff can exist, you know, without some of those like gallery limitations, but yeah, fuck it. Like open a gallery. Yeah. I want you to like, that was such a nice way to spend my Sunday afternoon.

Yeah. Absolutely. Um, well, so thanks to all the people at kitchen for having me today. I was very well looked after. Um, I even got a little belated birthday present from Casey, which was really sweet. Yeah, it’s cool. Um, and yeah. All right. Run the tape. My name is Mackenzie. My Instagram handle is McKenney.

Um, my practice is at the moment creating, um, like ceramic self portraits. They’re kind of like little versions of me doing random things that I do in like a realistic setting. And then also like dream state.

Um, I don’t know why I started doing that. It kind of just like came from my love of making like little girls out of ceramics. And I also make like castles and stuff. So I guess my stuff’s in a bit of a fantasy setting. My name’s Mariana. My Instagram handle is ma underscore dr.

My practice kind of revolves around a lot of the time. Um, like half is clay from, um, where my dad lives in the blue mountains. And I kind of use that as a catalyst for kind of going into more of the sciencey kind of chemical composition of everything. And then also what that means in terms of just like the tactility of working with, um,

things that don’t necessarily always work out. Um, and making a lot of also alongside that kind of, um, very rough mud, um, making like little figures and little paintings, um, uh, just kind of revolving around memory and touch

and that ceramic kind of beauty around. Yeah. That it’s been around forever and your touch is in it forever. It’s pretty cool. Beautiful. Cool. Thanks guys. Hey, you’re listening to hung up. I’m here at, how do you say, is it the kitchen or kitchen? Kind of both. I’m here at the kitchen.

Um, so how long has this place been going for? Since December, 2020. 20. Cool. I feel like people would be interested in some like of the practical like parts of setting up a studio. Can I get like an info dump from you guys? So like, um, can you talk me through the process of like finding a place and like sorting

out the commercial lease and stuff like that? Absolutely. Um, well, we had a really great real estate agent for this place who was really enthusiastic and helped us a lot because of course we didn’t know anything about commercial leases whatsoever. Um, but we spent about like two months looking for a space going to different inspections

around two months. It felt like longer. It felt so long. Um, and then we, there was a lot of cluing out, um, electricity because we need three phase power to run our kilns because we obviously have four ceramicists with us. And so that was confusing because we didn’t understand so much of like what it took to have a functioning

like warehouse space and to make it nice. Mm hmm. A couple of the places that we were interested in were, um, definitely not up to scratch, but we didn’t know that for ages. And so figuring out what we needed took probably the longest part.

Uh huh. Interesting. Yeah. I wouldn’t have thought, but yeah, of course I need heaps of power. It gets fucking hot. Yeah. And you’re, you’re both ceramicists, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I was looking at your works downstairs and I was sorry to have missed that homies show. It looked excellent. It’s really cool. Yeah. Um, so can I like you’re, it’s okay if you don’t say, but can I ask like how you guys

all pay for this and like what the rents are and stuff like that? Yeah, for sure. People would want to know, I feel. Mm hmm. Well, we all have jobs that paid for, I mean, a lot of the huge like deposits that we had to put down in terms of getting the place, securing it was all from, thanks to lovely

um, JobKeeper, lovely COVID-19 government subsidy. Yeah. So we’re actually sponsored by the federal government. The liberals. Yeah. Thanks. Thanks man. Yeah. We have, um, we have like 6k in bond. Me and Mary split that. Wow. Yeah.

Um, just from saving up. Hectic. That’s a serious commitment. Yeah. Well, that was our intention. Like when we finished NAS, our main concern was like kind of, um, just sticking together. Like me and Marianne shared our studio in third and second year. And we just wanted that again. That was really important to us because it was how we got used to making.

And we were like, we’re going to do that. We’re going to make a studio. We’re going to make a studio that’s what we want for creating. Um, and then it was our goal. So we kind of put money aside and like went out of our way to like make it happen. Yeah.

And that first year out of NAS, we both had studios that didn’t really have that community. And we felt that that was lacking. So we tried to make a space that did have that community aspect and interesting. Yeah. Yeah. We would, we were just at, um, tiles in Lewisham, um, yesterday. And, uh, we were talking to them about like, yeah, that word, I guess.

And like, they were saying that before it was the gallery, it was like a bit of a bikey hangout and like kind of like a bit of a minus on the suburb. People, all the neighbors are really not into it. And then, um, like that kind of set up for the community to be kind of a part of the space when, when like a nice, lovely looking gallery moves in, it kind of feels like so much more

like there’s a sort of ramp between everyday life. And then now you’re in an art exhibition rather than if like, it’s a brand new building, say, or it’s a perfectly white cube. Yeah. So I guess what I’m, I’m getting at is like, do you like, can you describe your ramp? Does it, does it feel like kind of enclosed or like Casey was talking about like, you know, the tradies next door and like all the people, like what, what does that look like for this place?

It was pretty strange moving into obviously a warehouse complex where there are completely different businesses running out of it. And that was actually pretty exciting. I mean, everyone here has been super lovely. Um, so it’s very strange as well for people to come into like a studio space where they’re like,

Oh, you’re artist studios and kind of expecting, Oh, in Marriottville, a rundown warehouse where it’s just you. There’s no other kind of community around it, but they like people having to walk up the ramp and go into this like very kind of new commercial strata managed warehouse complex. Um, and have like, yeah, tradies driving their trucks everywhere and like playing what triple M outside.

Yeah. We had to come up into this studio just to get away from the massive like radio set. So, I mean, it’s been pretty funny. And especially at the start when we first moved in, obviously I don’t think this has ever happened in this warehouse. And everyone was very curious as to what we were doing. Cause I’m a lot of the time it is just us looking like weird people.

Chilling out. Yeah. Sitting and talking and. Yeah. We’re occasionally setting up like handball outside. Yeah. Getting the ping pong table out. Looks like we’re just like hanging out. Yeah. People have like walked up, like some of the other neighbors have walked up and been like, what are you guys doing? Like we just really had to come and ask because it just looks so fun.

Well, it is fun. Yeah. Yeah. Did anyone ever like join in for some handball? We had one person. Yeah. There you go. We did. For a brief moment. And then she said, no, I’m not good at this. I have to run. Had her AirPods in, was talking to clients like straight afterwards. Beautiful. Wow.

Oh, that answers my question. Like exactly. I think. Yeah. Do you have a show, like have shows here? We never have. We haven’t. It’s a bit like, it’s kind of hard to do both. Right? Yeah. Have it as a studio and a show. Space is like a little bit limited. Yeah. Mariana and I are going to open a gallery. Yeah. Cool.

And we are in the process of figuring it out. Oh, wow. Is this like an exclusive scoop I just got? Is this a secret? No, we talk about it way too much. It’s not exactly a secret. We talk about it all the time, but it’s, it’s like that same process as when we were doing this, it’s like we’re figuring out a whole new thing that we’re trying to do.

Cause obviously like galleries don’t really make a lot of money. And so it’s again, a matter of us making some more savings to put some more money aside so that we can get something like that off the ground. Um, like this place pays for itself. We split all of the rent completely equally between all of our tenants.

There’s like eight of us. Cool. But a gallery would be like a completely different jump. So we’re just figuring that out, but that’s the next step. Yeah. Um, yeah, it was lucky architecture at tiles. They kind of have studios there that I guess they’re renting. Yeah. Plus the space itself. Yeah. It would be fantastic.

Cause then it kind of self funds itself. Sure. Yeah. Yeah. Which would be fantastic. I mean, we’re in the process of looking for another space. So yeah, we’re going to expand on this spot. We have, we unfortunately have to leave this warehouse. Oh no. When? In December or by December. That’s sad. They’ve said no more handball.

No more handball. We are done with the handball. No more fucking cute ceramics. Yeah. You guys look like you’re having fun. We need some serious tradies in here. Yeah. Well, that’s exactly right. Yeah. The building actually sold to a construction company. Of course. And they were moving. Of course. Yeah. Literally, that’s the response they get from everyone.

Yeah. It’s very Sydney. Very Sydney. Especially very Marrickville. Yeah. Yeah. Marrickville’s going that way. Yeah. I got the bus down to, I was going to, I was going to the Bolo on Friday night. I think we were all there. Yeah. And I just, I’d never gotten the, I hadn’t gotten the bus in so long. I caught the train and walked.

And it was like such a different suburb. All of a sudden there’s like all these new things popping up. Yeah. And it’s funny because like young, like artists, like us, we kind of, we can kind of like, we’re on a knife’s edge, you know, we can either get like trampled over by big constructions or if we’re lucky, like me, I’m involved with one of the venues that like maybe if we’re

lucky we’ll become a part of the district. Yeah. Yeah. Strange times for the inner west. It is. Very strange times. We were actually just did a couple of inspections today. Just before I’ve got my LJ. Oh, there you go. So you’re, you’re serious and you’re looking at places. Cool. Yeah. Yeah. Um, around Marrickville we want to stay.

Cool. Yeah. It’s been a good, a good year and a half so far. Um, ideally we were going to stay here for a lot longer. Um, but our landlord obviously wanted to sell. Fair enough. And we couldn’t buy it. Yeah. We thought about it for a hot second. Yeah. Yeah.

Look at the loans. Do you think banks would give us a loan? Look at our savings. A gardener and pottery teacher? Probably not. Yeah. Maybe. Maybe. We’ll see how it goes. Yeah. Um, what was the other question I wanted to say? Oh, so what are the, what are the criteria for looking for a gallery space? Like what have you guys got in mind? Well, we’d want it to be ground floor and very easily accessible.

Um, not have to walk upstairs or do any kind of like trying to get there. So therefore people just walking past could very easily kind of walk in. It wouldn’t have any kind of barrier, um, like physically and also just that emotional kind of barrier where you have to try and go. It feels kind of exclusive if you have to find the place.

Um, obviously we’d want it to be really light filled and preferably not moldy and flood damage like many places. We have a big ask around here. Yeah. But yeah, it’s possible. The place we just went and saw had the craziest mold and the ceiling was collapsing. It was like, it was like, it was like, it was like real charge.

Yeah. Yeah. It’s perfect. You’re like, Oh my God. What are you talking about? Yeah. Um, yeah. Which feels like a big ask at the moment, but yeah, preferably just an easy accessible, um, space preferably around here or towards the city, even, um, anywhere in this kind of

strip. Yeah. Yeah. But, um, there’s like heaps of really exciting galleries opening in Sydney at the moment. It’s kind of like filled up. Yeah. Yeah. It does feel like it’s popping off. Yeah. Especially like tiles and Sydney International down the road as well. Yeah. Like it’s really exciting.

And, um, we just have like a, like a, an idea that we want to see through, be very temporary in the nature of us, um, kind of committing to it only probably for like a few months because

we would rather like the quality of show over the quantity. Hmm. And then figuring like doing that first step, figuring it out how galleries work and then, um, kind of like what we’re doing with the studio space and doing it again next year, trying to make it better. Yeah. Kind of holding shows, then disappearing, then maybe holding another space, holding more

shows and kind of in that time in between kind of refiguring what worked, what didn’t work, how can we make this better? Mm. And so it didn’t, it wouldn’t have that kind of permanence so that we would have to have shows all the time to make it worth the money. Mm. Um, cause obviously we’re not flowing with money. I think permanence has been the hardest thing about doing what we’re trying to do.

Um, because everything’s changing every single second. And when we were looking at leases for galleries last year, the second lockdown happened. So we’re like, Oh, lucky we didn’t sign any leases then. Yeah. So it’s kind of like we’re, with this, this studio space and everything, like we’re kind of just adapting as things move and become harder and easier.

Mm. We just like want to, um, you know, be involved and participating, I guess, with our little show ideas that we have. Cool. So you’ve got some ideas for shows already or like the type of show you want to put on? Yeah. We have four shows lined up. Cool.

With the artists all involved and like making the work currently. And then, um, it’s kind of going to be like, okay, we’re ready. We’ll get the space. We’ll go in, we’ll hold them and then we’ll go out. Wow. Yeah. Cool. I’ve got this note that’s like, yeah, non white cube slash community. We kind of talked about the, like that sort of, that sort of motion from like you’re

in Lewisham to like, now you’re in an art gallery, like versus like you’ve kind of crossed some sort of membrane or threshold and you’re in like, um, I don’t know, white rabbit or something, which is like a serious gallery. Yeah. I just wonder if you guys have any thoughts about like, what will your gallery look like? Would it look more like tiles or yeah. You know, um, art gallery of New South Wales, like white cubey, like what, what, what attracts

you to, to galleries? I guess is what I’m asking. And like, how do you want yours to look? I mean, I guess a lot of the time it would very much depend on the space. Like for example, the gallery that I really love in Marrickville, um, the commercial gallery is just literally a warehouse looks exactly like our studio. They have this dock room, basically all of their rat paintings and huge scaffolding on

one side, and then they have the show in that space. And so it very much feels like, and you’re also welcome to walk through the office where they have artworks and, um, a little library where you’re also welcome to just sit. So it feels very much like a working hub. And I guess that’s really specific to its space. And so I guess that kind of melding of what already is physically there and then holding

art. I mean, I guess that’s kind of what tiles does there. Like space is, um, very much visible when you’re looking at the artwork as well. Um, and I guess that kind of draws me into that kind of gallery. Yeah. So you wouldn’t be like rendering the walls and making it all square and white, I guess

you’re saying. No, not necessarily. Not necessarily. Unless it, maybe unless it came like that, but yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Interesting. It does feel like the way that things are going and it feels more like, um, like ergonomic and humane and like a bit more sort of gentle, like of a way to do it. Like we were talking to Olga and Chris, who I think are, I don’t know if there’s more

people, but they seem to be running the show there at tiles. And they were kind of saying like, um, you know, the, the space kind of impresses some vibe on whatever show you put in there. And it kind of, I think it seems a lot more natural and like easy, you know, rather than like this perfect, like vacuum. Yeah. Yeah. I think the main thing for me is that a space, um, like sits nicely with the install that you’re

like trying to put, put on for your show and that they actually speak to each other. Um, sometimes like when the space is like too in your face and you can’t pay attention to the work, um, it’s a little bit like, huh.

But then again, like, I love like Pariari and the fact that that has like the menu from when it was like a takeaway food shop or something still up on the wall. I’m like, I think that that works so well with the works that are being exhibited there and the shows that they’re putting on. So I feel like it just makes sense for each person’s vision.

You know, finding the right space is really important. Sometimes that clean cube is like so necessary, I guess, for some people and what they want to put forth. Um, okay, great. Well, thanks for listening. We’re, there might be a couple more interviews while we’re here, but, um, yeah, that’s the head honchos, I think.

We’ve covered them. CEOs. CEOs. All right, you guys can get back to your cigars and cocaine up here. That’s what we do. I think it’s just Adam Sandler movie. Big Daddy. I actually really loved that movie when I was a kid. It’s really sweet, yeah. It made me feel really like sad for some reason. Yeah, yeah. It’s so sweet. It’s so sweet.

Yeah. It’s so sweet. Yeah. So super sweet. Fuck, I haven’t seen this in a while. Well, you know what? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Stick around. That’s what we’re doing today. Yeah. Do you do any work here or is it just DHS? Not at all. No, no, no. What, this is a studio space? No, it’s just a cinema. Oh, no, no, no, no.

All right, so I’m here. We’ve got all our lawyers present. It’s 1535 on the 22nd of May. Is that it? 23rd.

All right, let’s just start and people can come and go as they please. So can you guys just real quick like introduce yourselves and say who you are online and then what like a minute or so on your practice like if that’s cool. Okay. Casey, we’ll just go left.

All right. All right. Hi, my name’s Casey. My Instagram handle is ysaknek on Instagram and my artist just involves me painting robots and George Harrison’s on plates and pots and stuff. Oh, I’m Ben.

My Instagram is fauxgeordie. I make plates and ceramic figures. My name’s Sam Frank and I make paintings and sculptures out of paper mache and ceramics about crazy things.

My name is Mac Mansfield and I make paintings about making paintings. Cool. Really good answers, everyone. How long is everyone? Is everyone like did you guys all join this space at the same time or did like?

Yeah, we all did apart from Sam. Sam came about two months ago, but we’ve been here for. Oh, that’s why he’s on probation. You were saying. Yeah, he’s on probation. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But I’ve, I’ve, I’m off probation now and I’m a fully fledged member. Oh, congratulations. Thank you. Me and Sam used to share a studio space and it was really unhinged.

Yeah. So I think people were scared that we were just eyes. They weren’t allowed to join together because they notoriously caused issues for a, a, a, a really humble RE runner called Alex Latham who was running a gallery at the time called

Canteen and, um, you know, running an RE, running an RE is not easy at the best of times, let alone when you’ve got two cretins in your studio in the bathroom. I feel like this place has got a bit more of a respectful vibe. Like we just spoke to the, the CEOs before and they seem like they’ve got everything under control.

Yeah. Me and Sam have grown a lot since I’ve experienced. Yeah. It was also COVID and we were just locked in there for about a year. Yeah. Yeah. It’s enough to drive anyone insane, let alone a crazy artist. Yeah. Yeah. So the plan is to move to another place. I think, um, they were saying that like, yeah, the laces in, oh no, they were going to sell the building.

Right. Yeah. Oh, they already sold it. Fuck. So you, so you’re looking at new places and stuff and like, you all want to like stay together. Yeah. It feels a bit like a share house vibe. Like we’re all like fucking joking around and like chilling and stuff. Yeah. It’s definitely a share house vibe. I’m like sitting behind like a big TV with like heaps of like VHSs, um, and like DVDs lying around.

Yeah. During our lockdown, we were just playing PlayStation 2 and Switch like the whole time. Insane. Most of us spend more time here than at home. Like I’d say a large portion of us do probably spend a significant, not counting when you’re asleep, I guess, but most of us do spend a lot of our waking time at the studio.

So yeah, it’s, you do spend a lot of time there in the end. Wow. That’s, it’s kind of not how I’d imagine it. TBH, like no shade or anything, but if it was me, I’d probably spend like a couple hours a day there or something, you know, and like go do other shit. That’s cool. That’s fucking sick. Yeah, that’s cool. Um, Casey, you’ve had like some like representation, right?

Like, and, and like people kind of like just being your gallerist. Um, can you like, can you just talk me through like this, like the setup, like the structure of that? Oh, it’s pretty, I feel like I have a pretty, um, casual relationship with the gallerist as in like, I don’t have to worry too much. Um, you know, I, I, with my gallery, I pay about 50% for, um, that’s the commission he takes, which is like, I don’t have to worry too much.

Yeah. Like those kind of damage with it is because it can take 20 too much for me to pay less than 50%. the case is most commercial galleries will do 40 but then you’ve got to pay 40 to 50 but then you generally also have to account for tax which right is yeah tax but yeah but 50 is for me it’s

just no matter what i’ll be getting half okay yeah and it feels like worth it for you right like is that what you’re saying like it feels like a good deal yeah i think like oh at least in my case the galleries uh really does seem to care about the artists and the welfare and i’ve got a lot of autonomy like you know i normally can do shows with my friends or like at other exhibitions like

other galleries um and like you know um yeah just i think all i have to do is just make the uh and then the rest you know is that like an exclusive deal like are you allowed to show something at like you know my gallery or something um some galleries won’t let you yeah yeah okay or they’ll they’ll

ask for a percentage of so i think like maybe the galleries will split 25 25 percent yeah wow which is weird which which do you think yeah it like encourages people to not show artists that are represented because the the effort is to put on the show with that artist in it is the same no matter

what but they’re only getting a smaller portion of the commission because they’re splitting in between the things so they kind of do that as a disincentive for you to be treasonous yeah yeah that’s interesting i hadn’t thought of that one it’s they do that with musicians like if if you’re going to come and play like one of the big aussie festivals they’re like you’re not allowed

to do or like it’s tightly controlled sideshows yeah okay people you hear about it a lot but also when you win prizes i think there’s definitely a lot of commercial galleries take a commission of your prize winning when you win a prize i’ve never heard of that and it can be and it can be like the 40 to

50 percent give me that shit they’ll take off of a prize which is pretty huge thing that people don’t really realize yeah i think the thing with commissions and showing with the gallery i think this is would be the most goss that you could really say about it is that when you’re looking at showing at galleries you really need to be conscious of what they’re doing for you because the idea of the

commission is that there is actually a large out going for the gallery to put on the show there’s photos there’s prepping the space paying someone to install and de-install it it just depends how much work they’re doing how worth the commission they’re taking is and you’ll find a lot of commercial galleries that do put in a lot of money into like images and pr and like having someone

write about your work or arranging someone to write about your work making sure the space looks really nice when you show the work organizing who’s buying the work to pick it up and it’s like there there is a there is a lot that a gallery can do to make it worth the commission that you give them and then you’ll also find that there’s a lot of galleries that don’t really do that they try and do the bare minimum

amount of work so that they’re like it’s it’s it’s not more profitable for them but like they can put in a lot less time and get the exact same amount of money and i think like a few of us have all had that experience showing in different spaces yeah like a lot of galleries will show you work at art fairs and um you know yeah i guess some galleries will do a lot for you and others will do yeah the

bare minimum yeah in some way yeah are there any like red flags look out for if someone’s like sending you a dm like or something yeah i guess dms are pretty unprofessional yeah yeah and and just ask them ask them what they do if you do a show with them what role they’re going to take on doing the show yeah showing your work at art fairs and stuff like that that’ll be the bigger commercial

galleries that’ll be doing that but they’ll they’ll generally be putting in a lot because showing it those things is really expensive for those galleries yeah right there’s definitely galleries that are out there that have got a really good reputation and a list of buyers from older periods of time that are still just like resting on their laurels and doing it and you get it

you get specific dealers around sydney and specific galleries that are both now conceded to do the absolute bare minimum but still making an income off uh but and then there’s the really like driven i don’t know what i’m saying it’s hard though about the red flags thing though

because there’s way more artists than there are art galleries and even with the red flags you’re like i’m still i still kind of got to do this yeah yeah like yeah i as a musician i’ve definitely like willingly gone in like head first into a bunch of things that i just know weren’t gonna pay me

well like i’m gonna fuck me around in some way like yeah you kind of there’s always gonna be more like sit sit at home and yeah eat spaghetti or something yeah yeah pretty much do the shitty gig yeah yeah yeah kind of gotta do it yeah okay yeah it’s just like it’s almost like earning your stripes yeah you gotta pay your dues yeah fair enough there’s always

gonna be a bit of that in like the arts world i guess yeah yeah yeah cool okay and um does anyone have any shows coming up that they want to plug before we say goodbye uh i’ve got a show on the 9th of july that uh it opens on the 9th of july at grafton regional art gallery um and it will be me with 27 other artists from new south wales it’s it’s almost like a mini art fair cool and i’ll have

the store there sick yeah actually uh yeah tiles lewisham’s got a group show soon in june the 30th cool that’s the next one after this are you in it i’m in it um and then first there’s one at first raft it’s organized by my friend chris chiu and that’s like a group show and that’ll be

6th july on wednesday if anyone wants to come sick maybe i’ll get this information up i should plug it i have a gig on the 17th of june with eternal dust and wonderlust wonderlust is like a very exciting new band that only played a handful of shows so that’ll be a great 17th june where at oh cool i’ve got a gig coming up on the 9th of july at paro rsl what band battle snake

that’s sick yeah okay cool what a uh battle snake sound like um it’s like metal sounds like judas yeah it sounds like judas priest that’s my guitar hero 3 fave yeah i’m in a group show at um uh it’s a group show by um lily go slowly um apple pear on instagram mackenzie is also in it um

it’s a prop gallery in ashfield on the 20th of july beautiful great sick that’s it i think um i think we’re done here you guys are free to go clear to all charges so that’s it for us today you’ve just heard um well we’ll put all the ads in the thing you heard

their names um my name is matt i’m aiden thank you for listening this is hung up uh you can find us on instagram at hung up.au and please give us a fucking sick rating on itunes and spotify no itunes do we have itunes uh i mean apple podcast would be cool if we were on itunes we should i’ll

start uploading them to itunes too uh a dollar a track read our feature in hot new vape pods weekly yeah totally i forgot about that i’m pretty proud of that not gonna lie but yeah please um like actually tell your friends about it and fucking while you’re listening to this give us a quick five-star review we got like featured on apple pods a couple weeks ago yeah we got some big bump which

was really cool fast and i think that was from people leaving reviews so yeah if you’re if you’re still listening before we fucking before this episode finishes go over give us the review let’s right now yeah do it now go go go five four three two one go all right see ya bye co ampute

oh од

Show notes

We chat to @tiles.lewisham and @the_kitchen_studios for some stuff on DIY, anti white cube, and how galleries interact with their neighbourhoods. Good ep to listen to if you're thinking about setting up a gallery or an artist studio. Bonus discussion of the local Lewisham vape shop and its perpetual chess comp. Tiles: @osvyatova @christopherzburton  The Kitchen: @mackenni @ma_dr @yesac.nehc @foejorty @donna___rhea @littlefiringsquad